Dwarves and forest

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PawelS
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Dwarves and forest

Post by PawelS » February 12th, 2011, 12:36 am

Can someone tell me what was the reason of the design decision to make forest hexes cost only 1 movement point for the Dwarves? I can't think of a reason why they should be faster in forests than Humans...

(If this subject was already discussed, please direct me to an appropriate thread, I couldn't find any.)

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Zerovirus
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Zerovirus » February 12th, 2011, 12:36 am

Maybe they're shorter and can navigate under the trees?

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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by wesfreak » February 12th, 2011, 12:46 am

That's what it says in the description.

Also, balance overrides real life, and the low mp cost is necessary for dwarf balance.

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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Dixie » February 12th, 2011, 1:20 am

Dwarves already have little move points. 4 on average? 5 when they're quick? Sure, they move as fast on flat, forest or hills, but in this case "as fast" is not very extravagant (can't compare with the elvish archer's 6, or loyalist cavalries' and horsemen's 8).

On a more "thematic" answer, I'd say that it's not that much lack of "terrain profeciency" that make them slow, but just short legs. Slow but steady. Human are slowed in forests because they can't run through trees and watch their steps. Dwarves already go relatively slowly, so they'd have the time to watch their steps aplenty, shouldn't they?
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by sur.nhm » February 12th, 2011, 12:06 pm

I seem to remember one thing in the help section mentioning the dwarves cutting their way, thence them not being slowed, but being so unfamiliar with the terrain, thence the low defence.
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Velensk » February 12th, 2011, 12:27 pm

I'd always interpreted forests as just being part of dwarven terrain abiet a part which they had no special techniques for fighting in for itself. Most non-desert mountains I've been in have trees quite a bit of the way up the slope and if you lived in or around them I imagine you'd learn enough woodcraft to not be slowed overmuch especially if you're tough enough to shrug off thorns.
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by StDrake » February 12th, 2011, 12:52 pm

I'd blame it on formations - dwarves are used to caves and mountains, so they use rather loose formations that don't get bogged down by complex surroundings and their tactics make use of rather the terrain shape than detail. They're not used to forests so it's not as stable and defence-friendly as stalagmites, but they don't pose a problem in movement in the same way.
That and they don't have such big problems with ramming their heads into the lower branches.
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SkyOne
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by SkyOne » February 12th, 2011, 1:22 pm

PawelS wrote:Can someone tell me what was the reason of the design decision to make forest hexes cost only 1 movement point for the Dwarves? I can't think of a reason why they should be faster in forests than Humans...
[movement_costs] forest=1 means the full movement. If the movement of your dwarf unit is equal to four, the unit is able to move four hexes even on the forest terrains.
So dwarves are not particularly slow on the forest terrains. They are just slow on any terrains.
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Gambit » February 12th, 2011, 2:55 pm

Well... they are mountaineers.

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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Dave » February 12th, 2011, 6:15 pm

A dwarf is a stout, determined creature, that will get to his destination one way or another. He won't let a few trees slow him down!
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by hiro hito » February 12th, 2011, 7:34 pm

The strangest thing is that poacher has 2 moves on forest! I agree that he's human but poacher usualy leave/hide in forest but he's the slowest unit of his faction!
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by PeterPorty » February 12th, 2011, 10:37 pm

Dude, WINR and balance is much, much more important.
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PawelS
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by PawelS » February 12th, 2011, 10:41 pm

Dave wrote:A dwarf is a stout, determined creature, that will get to his destination one way or another. He won't let a few trees slow him down!
I like this explanation :)
hiro hito wrote:The strangest thing is that poacher has 2 moves on forest! I agree that he's human but poacher usualy leave/hide in forest but he's the slowest unit of his faction!
I agree, such peculiarities are the reason I started this thread.
PeterPorty wrote:Dude, WINR and balance is much, much more important.
What is WINR?

Edit: Found it :) (But I don't think it means some things were changed deliberately to make it less realistic ;))

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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Hulavuta » February 12th, 2011, 10:56 pm

It doesn't. It means that it isn't good justification if you say that something should be included/excluded if it is/isn't realistic.
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Re: Dwarves and forest

Post by Atz » February 13th, 2011, 1:52 am

hiro hito wrote:The strangest thing is that poacher has 2 moves on forest! I agree that he's human but poacher usualy leave/hide in forest but he's the slowest unit of his faction!
Maybe poachers move through the forest cautiously and stealthily, which is why they have high defence, while the dwarves just go crashing through it.

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