Scale?

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Scale?

Postby Federalist marshal » December 26th, 2007, 6:33 am

I know that Wesnoth isn't supposed to be realistic, but I would like to know what the scale would be, or an approximation at least. Based on my simple calculations, one hex would be roughly one mile across.
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Re: Scale?

Postby Viliam » December 26th, 2007, 10:02 am

Federalist marshal wrote:Based on my simple calculations, one hex would be roughly one mile across.

This seems realistic. But Wesnoth does not aim for reality; one hex is simply one hex -- analogies to reality are just for player's imagination. Just like in chess you should not worry too much about the size of squares. ;-)
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Postby Chris NS » December 26th, 2007, 11:28 am

It can also vary from scenario to scenario. In the Eastern Invasion, for instance, one scenario represents Weldyn as a keep plus a few villages, and the the next scenario the entire map is Weldyn.

But if it's any use, the smallest a hex could be is the range of a bow. Anything smaller would need multi-hex attacks, which would lead to mass resignation of the coders.
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Postby Samantha » December 26th, 2007, 12:33 pm

I always imagine the hexes to be about 10 feet across and each containing a single unit. I always thought that the archers had to get right next to each other because they couldn't otherwise shoot around objects or be able to hit anything. Either that or they have really poor vision or keep their arrows on strings or something.

Who knows.
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Postby Jozrael » December 26th, 2007, 3:18 pm

Each is the width of the space monkey's ship.

Regardless of what form its chosen to take today.

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Re: Scale?

Postby Federalist marshal » December 26th, 2007, 4:15 pm

Viliam wrote:
Federalist marshal wrote:Based on my simple calculations, one hex would be roughly one mile across.

This seems realistic. But Wesnoth does not aim for reality; one hex is simply one hex -- analogies to reality are just for player's imagination. Just like in chess you should not worry too much about the size of squares. ;-)

Well, I didn't really expect to get a solid answer, really I just wanted opinions for comarison.
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Postby Aethaeryn » December 26th, 2007, 4:43 pm

A hex is purposely abstract, it is the size of whatever fulfills its purpose. It can be really small in an RPG or really large in some "traveling" scenarios in campaigns. It isn't even consistent in the same area in campaigns, compare the first and second scenario of Liberty.
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Postby Samantha » December 26th, 2007, 5:18 pm

But if the hexes can change sizes like that then it raises the problem that when the hexes get large scale the units on the map become *significantly* faster!

I mean, a unit that can cover 6 10-foot hexes in two hours (one turn) can ALSO cover 6 1-mile hexes in the same two hours?

I just assumed that the town shrank ;-)
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Postby Velensk » December 26th, 2007, 5:37 pm

I always picture each unit as around 300ish people and covers many miles. Except in some senarios where the scale is much smaller.
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Postby Federalist marshal » December 26th, 2007, 8:59 pm

In other hex-based games like battle isle I do believe that is the case, but since each unit in the game has a personal name and traits then wouldn't that mean that each unit is a single soldier?
Wait...one turn is two hours?! I thought that one turn was four hours! But that's based on the fact that one day is 24 hours, and that there are six phases to the day in-game.
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Postby thespaceinvader » December 26th, 2007, 9:43 pm

One turn is (around) 4 hours. 2 hours is incorrect.

The scale is very mutable. One hex can be many miles across (see levels such as the final scenario of HttT, where the entirety of the capital city of wesnoth is around 5 hexes across, or the fact that in general whole villages fit into a single hex) or only a few dozen feet at best (most cave scenarios). One unit could represent just that, a single unit. Or, it could represent a squad, or even a battalion of similar or identical units. The names can be for the single unit, or representative of the leader of that squad/battalion.

WINR, basically. It means what you want it to mean, and the scale is whatever you want it to be. Bear in mind that we're talking about a game units which stand taller than entire village houses, and houses that are the same size as mountains.
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Postby VThornheart » December 26th, 2007, 10:23 pm

Samantha wrote:But if the hexes can change sizes like that then it raises the problem that when the hexes get large scale the units on the map become *significantly* faster!

I mean, a unit that can cover 6 10-foot hexes in two hours (one turn) can ALSO cover 6 1-mile hexes in the same two hours?

I just assumed that the town shrank ;-)


Aye, you're very correct... that's why I tend to view the game as more of a "strategical simulation of actual battlefield combat" than a realistic view of the combat itself.

So when I'm playing the game, I imagine that there *is* actually a battle going on, but what I'm seeing is the equivalent of a sketched interpretation of that battle. Units are "next to each other" when they attack, but not really etc...
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Postby Federalist marshal » December 27th, 2007, 12:55 am

Whenever I visualize a battle, I envision the units as being constantly moving about in the area that is represented by a hex. For example, if I wanted to visualize a bowman/thunderer fight in forest terrain, I'd envision the bowman as running about and using the trees for cover, firing arrows as accurately as he can, while the thunderer slowly works his way through the trees, trying to get a good shot at the bowman. So if my mental visualization is correct, then one hex would be at least 50 feet across. But of course, since nobody actually made a standard scale, I'm probably wrong.
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Postby Dave » December 27th, 2007, 4:48 am

Everything in Wesnoth -- hexes, units, villages, time, gold, etc -- are abstractions for a battle that is taking place. They will inevitably fall apart if one over-analyzes them.

Do you really think that if you capture a village at midnight, it'd have paid you some gold in taxes by dawn? Can one guy really capture a village? Why can't more than one guy be in the same hex, since hexes are obviously pretty big? Why can a castle only fit eight guys in it? (Especially since it covers many square miles!) Wouldn't your units collapse from exhaustion after 96 hours of straight fighting?

Anyhow the answer to how large hexes are is simple: they are one league across. :)

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Postby Federalist marshal » December 27th, 2007, 4:58 am

Well, if Wesnoth were actually realistic, then it wouldn't be Wesnoth, now would it? And I apologize if the concept were really that offensive.
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