Incomplete Unit Directory

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SmokemJags
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Incomplete Unit Directory

Post by SmokemJags » March 6th, 2006, 5:55 am

I recently reinstalled 1.1.1 now that it works much better... and this is something I've wondered about. Why is the unit directory incomplete?

For example... you can't look up a 'drake warden' until you manage to level up to one or see the computer player using it.

On one hand, it makes special units like yetis very interesting, because you never even knew they existed. Very cool.

On the other hand, it's annoying as heck for units that you level up and recruit... such as the level 3 drakes. So what's the deal? Intentional, byproduct of something else, or ...?
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Ranger M
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Post by Ranger M » March 6th, 2006, 8:14 am

The thing is that that is exactly how it happened to me when I first got Battle for Wesnoth, and how it is supposed to happen. You can only read the stats of a unit once you have seen it or had it (or been able to get it through leveling up, but chosen the other option). If you want to see all of them then there is a file in the second wesnoth folder (the one with the UMCs in it) which lists all of the units that you have seen so far, add all the units that you want to see to that list and they will appear in the Unit directory.

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Post by Elvish_Pillager » March 6th, 2006, 10:13 pm

OFWRA! There's been a lot of arguing over the existence of this unfeature, never settled well.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

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Post by SmokemJags » March 6th, 2006, 11:19 pm

RTFM?
existence of this unfeature, never settled well.
I've never seen any talk about it. Must have been before my time. I haven't even been here a month after all.

Would it be possible to make it so that all 'common' units and their higher level versions are visible from the start.
For example, after a fresh install if I wanted to look up the drakes they would all be there. From the level 1 drake fighter to the level 3 drake inferno and everything inbetween.

The only units visible after a fresh install are those that belong to the three default multiplayer faction.
Default
Age of Heroes
(I forget what the third one is called)

All custom units, special units, and campaign units would remain hidden. So you can't look up the yeti or cockatrice until you encounter them.
and how it is supposed to happen.
Why exactly is that how it's 'supposed' to happen? Some malarky about having to gather 'intelligence' about units before they're cataloged into a library?

That's fine for specials like chocobone, but for a playable faction...
Like for loyalists, I think it would make sense to be able to see the entire level tree for the sergeant-lieutenant-general-grand marshal as soon as I install the game.
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Post by turin » March 6th, 2006, 11:23 pm

SmokemJags wrote:
and how it is supposed to happen.
Why exactly is that how it's 'supposed' to happen? Some malarky about having to gather 'intelligence' about units before they're cataloged into a library?
Yep, some BS like that. Its one of the stupidest "features" in BFW. Most people I've talking to are in agreement about that...



Although it shouldn't wipe the list of collected units when you reinstall - I wonder what's up with that. Maybe it wiped your preferences dir. :?
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Post by SmokemJags » March 6th, 2006, 11:43 pm

When I reinstall... I wipe the slate clean first.
I deleted the directory and installed completely fresh. I find it helps deal with problems that occur when you overwrite old versions with newer ones.
Plus when I had 1.1.1 before, I tweaked a lot of the units and stuff for fun. Simply installing over probably would have fixed it, but I wanted to be sure everything was pristine and just like new. :)
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Zhukov
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Post by Zhukov » March 7th, 2006, 12:24 am

If you need to see unit stats but haven't "seen" the units in-game yet, you can always use this. It is a list of all mainline units, and you can set it to show you whatever information you need to see (for eg. you could set it to show you only HP of all units, or full stats of just Drake units etc).

Personally I don't really mind the way that units only show up after you have come across them. It's good for newcomers because it doesn't flood them with information, half of which they won't be needing for a long, long time.

That said, I can see how it could be annoying. I suppose there could always be a...*gasp*...option. :P

Yeah I know, Options Are Bad (OAB), but in this case...

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Post by SmokemJags » March 7th, 2006, 12:36 am

I thought that stood for "Opinions are bad"...
I'll be damned it does say options. I thought it was opinions this whole time... Heh.

I've been to that site, it's handy but I like to have a more complete picture 'in game'.

As it is now... I sometimes feel like part of the game is to 'fill up' the encyclopedia.
"Let's see for today's bird watchers group... you have to find the Loyalist General, Loyalist Grand Marshal, Troll Warrior, and Yeti. Happy hunting!"
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Post by Dacyn » March 7th, 2006, 1:16 am

Idea: instead of removing the feature, just change the advanceto links that currently don't work so that they do work. (i.e. you can see the General's stats by clicking on the link in the Lieutenant's description). This would solve the problem while not completely removing the feature...

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Post by turin » March 7th, 2006, 1:19 am

Dacyn wrote:Idea: instead of removing the feature, just change the advanceto links that currently don't work so that they do work. (i.e. you can see the General's stats by clicking on the link in the Lieutenant's description). This would solve the problem while not completely removing the feature...
So, it would still hide the stats of the general, but if you clicked the "advances to" link, it would reveal the stats of the general?


I like it. It lets curious players, and those who already know it somehow, to view the stats in-game, but it lets normal players not worry about the number of units until later...
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Post by SmokemJags » March 7th, 2006, 1:22 am

So there's no such thing as an inactive 'advanceto' button...
I like it.

The general isn't listed by default...
But say the lieutenant is, and from his screen you can see the general from the 'advanceto' button and then it would reveal him.
Sounds good to me.
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Post by Skippy » March 7th, 2006, 2:21 am

Zhukov wrote:It's good for newcomers because it doesn't flood them with information, half of which they won't be needing for a long, long time.
Oh, I don't know about that. I'm a newcomer and it's not good for me. I want information when I'm first playing a game. I imagine that many others would feel similarly.

Lack of information just leads to frustration. Deliberately withheld information leads to stronger feelings.

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JW
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Post by JW » March 7th, 2006, 3:04 am

This has frustrated me several times when I tried to investigate the balances of some user-made factions. Specifically the Imperial era.

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Post by SmokemJags » March 7th, 2006, 3:09 am

Funny you should mention the Imperial Era.
I was just playing that and that's why I brought up this issue. Soo many units in that era but can't hardly look any of them up without playing it extensively beforehand.
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Post by JW » March 7th, 2006, 3:29 am

My solution: Go through all the unit.cfg and copy the data by hand. :evil: :evil:

That sucked.

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