Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Feedback for the mainline campaign Descent into Darkness.

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savescummer
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Joined: January 22nd, 2011, 5:00 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by savescummer » January 23rd, 2011, 3:58 am

1: medium difficulty, 1.8.0
2: difficulty n/a - see below.
3: I already knew about the Lich's drain attack, so the scenario objectives were clear enough.
4: dialogue was decent.
5: major challenges n/a - see below.
6: for me, a lot of fun - see below.
7: more fun? Yes, depending on your definition of 'fun' - see below.
8: restart? No, I wouldn't say that...

All, right, enough playing around. I will probably hate myself for telling you this, but there's a scenario-breaking move. Start Malin at (21,30) and then move him to (22,26). As a consequence, Malin is given infinite turns to complete the scenario, and can accrue infinite gold. To the extent of my ability to understand WML, this hasn't been fixed as of 1.9.4. Thanks for a fun campaign anyway!

Doopliss
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Joined: February 9th, 2011, 8:29 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by Doopliss » February 14th, 2011, 6:24 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Normal (Challenging), 1.8.5

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
1. Only extreme recklessness could cost you this mission.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
A bat's counter-attack triggered the "life drain" dialogue, so the "regain your strength" objective was quite clear. I wasn't sure if "Kill all trolls" meant leader-killing or full-on genocide.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Malin's already-rocky character transition seemed to hit a big clunk here, as he goes into full-on villain mode talking about "a worthy stronghold" and "exterminating the pests."

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
2. Just wandering about killing enemies that only half-fought back.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe tone down the supervillain dialogues, make the stage a bit shorter and improve the enemy AI. At least so they don't stand around letting you hit them.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
I was extremely reckless. ;)

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GagarinGambit
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by GagarinGambit » March 3rd, 2011, 1:14 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Hard, 1.8.4

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
1, piece of cake. The trolls will do nothing until they see you, take your time, kill them one by one. I suppose this scenario is meant to give you a break after the insanely difficult Alone at Last. I almost get the feeling the AI is broken, it will do nothing until you're spotted.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
It's not that clear, defeating the troll leader seems to be enough.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
The beginning is pretty good; otherwise, there's not much dialogue here. BTW, I must point out again that's a very good story. You feel you're dealing with real people, it's well written and, most important, it doesn't distract you from the game play. Many congratulations to the people who wrote the dialogue!

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None at all, this is one of the easiest scenarios I've ever played, and it follows one of the hardest scenarios I've ever played.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6. It's good, as this campaign is, but it's way too easy for my taste.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
A liiiitle more challenge? Make the trolls a little more aggressive, for instance. It's extremely easy if you have all the time in the world to defeat them.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Restart this scenario? :D
Linux. Space technology.

podbelski
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Joined: June 7th, 2011, 8:35 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by podbelski » July 10th, 2011, 9:10 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.9.6, Hard, 100gp, no reloads

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
1 to assasinate troll leader if you have strong ghosts. Definitely more difficult if you want to kill many trolls, spiders etc, or have to start w/o veterans.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6, good

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I already have a feeling the campaign is coming to an end, so giving the player a choice to meet the objective easily is good. If you want you can still wonder around the caves killing some creatures... So I think it's good as is

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
rats/bats killed Malin a couple of times, restarted
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taptap
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by taptap » November 8th, 2011, 7:39 pm

Once you know, that there are trolls to be taken serious somewhere so I should spent part of the gold on recalls instead of all new recruits, it was too easy to be interesting. Especially spectres usually don't even lose hp when engaging trolls. Making it difficult for no reason isn't logical - you faced the biggest challenge in the scenario before.

So, I wouldn't mind if it is removed, or reduced to the lichification process as an interlude.
I am a Saurian Skirmisher: I'm a real pest, especially at night.

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Ninjuri
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by Ninjuri » May 25th, 2012, 1:22 am

Normal 1.10.2

Difficulty: 6

Objectives 100% clear, it even shows you where the troll castle is

Dialogue is nice, although it's pretty weird that turning into a lich did not make melvin significantly stronger, as the storyline would suggest, just a different unit.

Challenges were choosing which units to step into line of sight to tank the troll attacks. A spider went on a rampage and took down my only necrophage to save 2 sorcs. Then another challenge was choosing how long to gather outside the troll castle before storming in. The more units i massed, the quicker i could kill and less chance my vets would die in the battle, but the more precise i would have to be to match the turn limit.

Fun: 8

No changes.

I had to re-load a few times to stop a random troll that wandered south from one hitting my sorcs.
Fate is against me.

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Pewskeepski
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by Pewskeepski » April 25th, 2013, 11:55 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Summoner (Difficult), 1.11.2

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
It says clear the cave of trolls, when you really only need to kill the leader.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Excellent. Found a typo: Line #549, Mal Keshar says "by" when he should say my.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Not getting crushed by trolls...

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
It wasn't much of a 'real' battle, and kinda boring. The troll leader should recruit some backup. Nothing too big, a few Whelps would be sufficient.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Mal Keshar was destroyed by a few lucky bats. Restarted from start every time.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
Looks good.
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flammstrudel
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by flammstrudel » May 5th, 2013, 3:58 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.10.2 Summoner (difficult) – no reloads

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
1/10 but I did have 3 surviving spectres (best troll counter ever) and 2 necromancers. If you lost everything during “Alone at last” it might be harder, but easy nonetheless

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Good. The whole campaign has been outstanding in this regard.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7/10 It's a dungeon crawl and winnable even with half a brain. I still liked it, don't know why.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Don't know.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No.

devavrata
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Joined: August 30th, 2012, 8:59 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by devavrata » May 27th, 2013, 10:33 pm

Content Feedback wrote:(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Battle for Wesnoth 1.8.3, Easy/Medium/Hard
Content Feedback wrote:(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
6
Content Feedback wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear
Content Feedback wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear. The wose is a surprise, true, but one I feel is uncalled for. What is a wose doing inside a cave?
Content Feedback wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Shamans are the toughest enemies there, but not too much trouble. More gold for the enemies.
Content Feedback wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7
Content Feedback wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
It is too easy, at least on the hard level.
Content Feedback wrote:(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No
Content Feedback wrote:(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
-

Davus
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Joined: May 28th, 2013, 3:13 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by Davus » May 29th, 2013, 5:56 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Version 1.11.4, Difficulty hard, 118 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
piece of cake

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
clear and well writen

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
none. Didn't meat the wose though. Went the eastern rout with ghosts, had no problems

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Make it more challenging. Give the Troll leader money to recrute something with. He starts with 60 Gold, but that gets subtracted before he even starts, because paying upkeep for his units allready on the map.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
none

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
It's pretty clear. Few errors though: The comments suggest the creator wants to have your base income at zero until you go to your starting keep and then at normal +2

So under side tab 1
"income=0" change to "income=-2"

And income should be set to "income=0" under
"[modify_side]
side=1
income=2
[/modify_side]"

Since it's additiv, the way it is writen at the moment you start with +2 income and get +4 as soon as you reach your starting keep.

Hope I've helped,
Davus

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Maiklas3000
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by Maiklas3000 » June 17th, 2014, 12:49 pm

(1) Level, version, and gold? Hard, 1.11.15, 100 starting gold.
(2) Difficult? (1-10) 3. I can't call it a "1", because I only use that for automatic victory, and I won't even call it a "2" because I use that for "you can lose only if you try", so I'll call it a "3", because you can lose if you get super unlucky.
(3) Objectives? Clear.
(4) Dialog? Excellent.
(5) Challenges? My Lichy leader almost died at the hands of rats and bats, after getting repeatedly unlucky.
(6) Fun? (1-10) 6, great atmosphere, but too easy to win.
(7) Changes? The entry to the large troll chamber should have a "skylight" (a lit passageway about 8 hexes in length) to prevent the player from just flying in a couple of Nightgaunts and assassinating the leader before he even recruits. If there is a side entrance, I guess you could leave it unlit, if there is a significant combat there like the spiders. (I don't know how the map is set up.)

I zombified a rat and was very disappointed to have it turn into a saurian zombie. The picture, I mean. I know that it is always a problem to have the artwork for zombies, but rat zombies need to be made a top priority. :)
(8) Restarts? None.
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Inky
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by Inky » September 28th, 2014, 9:26 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.10.4, hard, 75 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
2- just kill the troll leader with Nightgaunts.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
You don't actually have to clear out the trolls, just the leader.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Fine.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None at all.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5 - This scenario is practically begging you to just assassinate the troll leader with nightgaunts; however it feels really cheap / anticlimactic to do it this way.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe give the troll leader some guards that completely block up the passage so you can't get through with just Nightgaunts.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
None.

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nuorc
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by nuorc » February 27th, 2015, 2:53 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium, 1.12.1

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4 (For acceptable losses.)

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Not clear; it says clean out the cave while you 'only' have to kill the enemy leader.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Good.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Keeping the losses acceptable. I didn't have enough gold for a big experienced army; a few lucky hits with hammers or a streak of 3/3 magic attacks can nearly instantly kill any of my units.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe more starting gold and less villages. At a point I went back with my leader to get a few more units; it was ok, but not a 'flow'. It sounds like this is yet another scenario in quick succession where you could just send a few Shadows to get it over with quick.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Yeah, a few lucky enemy streaks decimating my forces.
I have a cunning plan.

czarkoff
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Joined: May 3rd, 2015, 5:39 am

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by czarkoff » May 4th, 2015, 8:27 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Easy, 1.12.2.

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
1 with using nightstalk assassination tactics.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear and interesting, although "ancient lich" is not exactly a proper description of Malin's background.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Keeping nightgaunts out of enemy's way.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5, mostly because of storyline.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Make the goal to kill everyone. Alternatively, if possible, turn off healing Mal Keshar in villages and by idling so that he can only heal himself by performing melee attacks and set objective to healing him.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
I had to go back when I foolishly occupied a village next to troll's castle and trolls came to claim it back, killing one of my two nightgaunts.
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ThirdParty
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 11 - Descent into Darkness

Post by ThirdParty » January 15th, 2017, 1:24 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium ("challenging") difficulty, 1.13.6.

This was the first "challenging" campaign I've attempted--previously I played the novice campaigns on "normal" difficulty--so I maybe wasn't prepared for how difficult the final scenarios would be.
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I liked the storyline of this scenario. Finding out how liches are created was interesting!
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The hardest part by far was the beginning. There I am, gradually regaining health by melee-ing rats and bats, when one (or sometimes two) giant spiders, capable of killing me in a single blow, jump out and attack me. It felt like my survival was dependent on pure luck and there was nothing much I could do to improve my odds.

The second part--finding and capturing the cavern with the villages in it--was also hard, though that was my own fault: I'd finished "Alone at Last" with minimum gold and most of my veterans dead.

Once I had a castle and income, defeating the trolls was straightforward.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
2. I liked the rest of the campaign, but this scenario was just frustrating.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
- Remove or tone down the giant spiders; the idea of having a completely deadly "giant spider" unit mixed in with the harmless "giant rat" units was kind of creative, but wasn't actually fun. (If the giant spider hadn't had a ranged attack, so I could kill it as long as I was the aggressor, or if its melee damage had been low enough to be survivable if I'd been doing a good enough job of draining hp from the rats and spiders, that would have been more fun than a strictly luck-based battle.)

- Reveal the cavern with all the villages in it at the same time as you reveal the enemy leader. With trolls bearing down, the player doesn't have time to hunt for it, and having to restart because you pick the wrong random passage to explore isn't fun. (Alternatively, include a village or two at the player's castle, to tide him over until he finds the cavern full of them.)
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
- Spiders killing me while I was trying to drain hp from the rats and bats. (About 15 restarts.)

- Assassinated by trolls that advanced down the main passageway while my best units were working on capturing the cavern with the villages. (1 restart.)

- I tried ignoring the rats and bats and rushing to the castle, in hopes of recruiting some units before the spiders attacked. Unfortunately, not fighting the rats and bats meant that Malin didn't have any hp and so couldn't help my recruits fight the spiders. Both spiders attacked together, and managed to kill/poison enough units that I no longer had the resources to capture the cavern with the villages in it, leaving me stuck. (1 restart.)

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