Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

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Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by Content Feedback » March 11th, 2008, 8:30 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
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leibe@verizon.net
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Joined: April 3rd, 2008, 10:06 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by leibe@verizon.net » April 3rd, 2008, 10:27 pm

:?:
I am playing version 1.2.3 on linux ubuntu. The goal for victory is "To reach the end of the mountain pass" which I did, but nothing happened. Am I also required to defeat Ork leaders, or is something malfunctioning with my version?

AI
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by AI » April 3rd, 2008, 10:45 pm

1.2.3 is release from 12 months ago, you should upgrade to a newer version. However, your savegames will not be compatible with the new 1.4 branch.

leibe@verizon.net
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Joined: April 3rd, 2008, 10:06 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by leibe@verizon.net » April 4th, 2008, 8:19 pm

is version 1.4 compatable with Linux Ubuntu

AI
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by AI » April 4th, 2008, 10:54 pm

Short answer: yes

Long answer:
It is in hardy's repository
Gutsy doesn't have it (but gutsy-backports does)
Even if you're running gutsy and don't want to add the backports-repository, you can still compile from source and it'll work fine.

leibe@verizon.net
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by leibe@verizon.net » April 6th, 2008, 8:23 pm

I am not running Gutsy, I'm running fiesty. Is it compatible, and will this solve the problem I am having bumping my head against a wall on the north end of the mountain trail when finishing "Beginning of the Revenge" :?:

AI
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by AI » April 7th, 2008, 12:42 am

I don't know if it's compatible, but it's about time to upgrade to gutsy anyway, since hardy will be out in less than a month. Of course, if you don't have that option, compiling from source is still possible.

revolushn
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Joined: April 26th, 2008, 8:45 am

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by revolushn » May 5th, 2008, 10:21 am

Well, I haven't done any reviews for any of the scenrios yet, but I really enjoyed this one so I thought I would. hope that's ok :)

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Evoker (Challenging)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
I can only compare it to other campaigns.. but not too hard once I figured out the best way to do it to conserve my troops. 4/10

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Not very to tell the truth. I thought that I had to kill the opponent leaders and get Malin to the checkpoint. All I had to do was kill the orc leaders. i would have finished a lot earlier if I had concentrated on simply killing them. no complaints though.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I'm finding the storyline great so far. It's only the fourth out of 11 and I'm really looking forward to where the story is going.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
No real challenges. i lost a few guys by going west first, but decided going north first was the best option (after I had to restart due to failing the first time). I only ever recruited ghosts and had 5 L2 Shadows from the previous scenario to recruit. I was really worried about my cash as I went down to -70 or so at one stage, but the bonus for finishing early more than made up for that.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
Yeah it was great - I dont play undead units much so it's different for me. I'm looking forward to the next levels in the campaign.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
None, It was challenging enough - I enjoyed the fact that a couple of the enemy fell through the ice :) and i was using ghosts so i guess they wouldnt have..? It advanced the story along well and I levelled up a few of my guys with only the loss of two level 2 units.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
I was forced to start again when I attacked the southern orc base with my ghost squad and moved my leader north (of course I was thinking I had to get him to the signpost in the north). needless to say he was killed by the Northernmost orc. Killing the North Orc first with all my units, and then going south worked fine the second time through.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
Sorry I don't but trying to teach myself atm :)

Zajoman
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by Zajoman » August 11th, 2008, 9:58 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Easy.

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Not very. I'm not quite sure where to go with Malin. I just hope it's the crossroads sign.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Very good. Good idea with the ice. I like the whole campaign and its storyline very much. It caught my fancy from the very first mission.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
I'm able to kill the south leader, but only after a gruesome battle and in about turn 32. I just don't really get how to beat both of them and yet bring Malin to the north in time. Maybe I'm missing a way to kill just the leaders and avoid their armies, but fighting them is, well, not too damn difficult, but it takes time.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
About 8. However, I've played it for the fifth time now and I'm getting pretty frustrated.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
During intro, I would make the camera point out the exact spot where to bring Malin, making the objective clear.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Being unable to beat the mission in time.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
Haven't had a look at it.

miekka
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Joined: December 30th, 2007, 2:48 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by miekka » August 19th, 2008, 2:17 pm

1. Easy
2. 6, but the ice makes it easier
3. somewhat unclear, I killed both orc leaders but I didn't have to move Malin to the end of the valley? Is defeating the orcs optional? It didn't say so for me.
4. Very nice, I really like how Malin's portrait face (and his mind too, judging by his dialog) begins to corrupt, much like in Knights of the Old Republic.
5. having enough villages nearby to heal my units
6. 8, luring the orcs in the ice is so fun :D
7. too calm music... it needs ANGER, REVENGE, MARCH OF THE UNDEAD etc.
8. none that would end the mission
9. dunno wml

blue
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Joined: July 8th, 2009, 11:43 am

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by blue » September 1st, 2009, 5:27 pm

1. Evoker (Challenging) 1.6.4
2. 6
3. Clear
4. Its fine
5. None
6. 7
7. None
8. Had to restart the scenario once but it was because i made some mistakes

Benefuchs
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Joined: February 24th, 2009, 9:40 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by Benefuchs » October 15th, 2009, 11:25 pm

1. medium, 1.6
2. 5
3. As said before: Just killing the orcs seems to be enough.
4. nice
5. None
6. 7
7. no idea.
8. did a reload once when some of my skeletons drowned when the ice broke. I mean, they have submerge, they can stand deep water, so why do they die (well, or cease to exist) as well? (Bug or feature?)

nils78
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Joined: December 15th, 2009, 6:08 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by nils78 » December 18th, 2009, 12:39 am

1) easy, 1.4.5
2) 8
3) Well, I didn't really read the instructions, I just killed all orcs (which worked)
4) It's Ok.
5) Took me a couple of tries until I had figured out how to use my ghosts to distract the enemy long enough to get my troops into position. Apart from that, dealing with all the enemies with fire attacks took getting used to.
6) 7
7) I think it is fine as it is
8) It took me a couple of attempts until I fielded my armies in a way that allowed me to meet the enemy on my terms, instead of getting butchered. However that is more my inexperience than the scenario.

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Maiklas3000
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by Maiklas3000 » July 29th, 2010, 11:09 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Difficult (hard); 1.8.3; 282 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Not clear. Killing the leaders is sufficient, but I thought at first that you had to run to the signpost as well.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Excellent. For ice breakthroughs after the first, I would use a shorter dialog, like just "It falls through the ice." Also, I would make that appear before the leader's, "Feel my wrath" line.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
This was a real mind bender. Coming up with a game plan was difficult.

The first challenge was recruiting, which was a big question mark. Skeletons and skeleton archers were available. But the mountainous geography cries out for ghosts and their kin. I had just two shadows and a wraith for relevant recalls. For my recruits, I first went fairly heavy on ghosts, and when that didn't work I switched to ghosts almost entirely, which worked.

The next challenge was how to deploy the recruits. There are three fronts: the two enemy strongholds plus the center of the board. Breaking forces into three generally resulted in close defeats on all three fronts. I decided to eliminate the middle front entirely, by having my leader and the necromancer run south to hide in the mountains. (I could consider this only after I read somewhere that you don't have to run to the signpost.)

The final challenge was timing. For the leader assassination squads, you have to wait until the enemy forces have left the keep area, and you should wait for night. I'm not accustomed to waiting around like this. My assault finally began on turn 8 at nightfall and was over on turn 9, second watch. The casualties were just two ghosts. I wonder if it would have been better to go slower and try to gather some XP rather than gold.

I learned something about the AI. If you sit on the doorstep of the AI's keep with a large assassination force, but the AI has no units that can cross the intervening terrain, then the AI behaves pretty much as if your force was not there, even if your force can cross the terrain. The AI does not leave units behind to defend against yours. If you then send one unit to the other side of the terrain, then the AI will move units towards it. It seems that the AI does not know how to defend if it cannot attack.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
This is ultimately just a leader assassination scenario. I hardly engaged any units other than the two leaders. It would be more challenging and fun if you also had to run to the signpost (even after killing both leaders.)

Like others, I don't like that skeletons die if they fall through the ice, although I never saw that happen. Anything with submerge should survive. Can't you code that in WML?

The map is clearly designed with the goal of forcing the scenario to play out a certain way. My preference is for geography that seems random and natural, allowing for a wide variety of strategies.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
I lost several times, each time restarting from turn 1.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
It's very lean on comments. Could add some about the ice, and the reasons for AI parameter choices.
Attachments
DID-Beginning_of_the_Reve..._replay.gz
(60.32 KiB) Downloaded 412 times

Thrash
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Re: Scenario Review: DiD 4 - Beginning of the Revenge

Post by Thrash » August 9th, 2010, 3:34 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

1.8.3, Hard, 208 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

6, the first couple turns of engagement were touch and go until I got the flaming arrow archers under control (the breaking ice helped a lot).

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Usual confusion about the win conditions being an AND or OR.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

One nit, Malin will say his "Feel my wrath" line sometimes when a creature falls through the ice, which doesn't make a lot of sense.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Flaming arrows, torches, and still figuring out how to use undead effectively.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

7, the ice was something different and had a real impact on my play. Nice idea.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

Nothing comes to mind.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

At first I tried to do the leader assassination but it seems to take a lot of luck, shadows are just too fragile and don't hit enough to consistently kill the leader before they get killed (and since they have a melee attack, they are almost certain to get wounded in their attack if not killed). I did finally get assassination to work, after about 6 tries, and it does result in a quick win with a nice bonus. I think you really need 2 shadows attacking each leader to consistently make it work.

Since I it took me so many tries with assassination, I decided that wasn't a 'clean win' and went back and did a more conventional assault up the middle. I rushed ghosts to hold the shore line of the river, reinforced them with my leaders and a handful of skeletons and ghouls. There I chewed up the initial wave of enemies, thought it was a little touch and go until some ice broke to cut down their options. Then I pushed over the river and due north and got to the sign post at turn 29. Would have killed the northern leader but got unlucky in my attacks. Leveled a number of units in the process. Didn't lose any leveled units, but did lose a few nicely experienced ones, mainly in the first couple turns of engagement on the shore before breaking ice limited archer attacks.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?

No comments that I can see and seems like the ice breaking could use some.

(Replay attached, but it crashed my app whenever I try to replay it.)
Attachments
DID-Beginning_of_the_Rev..._replay.gz
(42.03 KiB) Downloaded 330 times

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