Scenario 9: Houses of the Dead

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Scenario 9: Houses of the Dead

Postby Content Feedback » May 22nd, 2009, 11:15 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby lotsofphil » June 7th, 2009, 11:05 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? 3
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Clear enough.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? I liked the snippets of dialog as you found ghosts in the huts.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? Being patient and sitting on the village after getting the lightning staff.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? 6
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? Let you control the ghosts?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario? See below.

I've run through this campaign on easy so I knew where the secret passage was. By this point Delfador is quite strong. The only tough part was waiting in the little alcove after getting the lightning staff. Any more than 1 skeleton at once and the HP dwindled. I just sat on the village, taking one at a time and then moved out to get the leader.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Heruka » July 4th, 2009, 9:09 am

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? 7
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? Meeting the ghosts was fun. Sad to see them all "die again." :(
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? I simply could not stop the waves of attackers after getting the staff from the ancient spirit.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? Could be more fun if balance issues were fixed.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? Perhaps when you awoke the ancient spirit, all the ghosts would rise up to help you. Maybe this would take the waves of skeletons off your back for a while.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
See below.


I am playing this scenario on medium difficulty and I have to admit it's very challenging. I eventually gave up on restarting levels just to get the best possible rolls.

Even if I cheat with Dalfador XPed up to level 4, a level which is almost impossible to get to naturally (unless, I imagine, I used Dalf to kill every single leader in the game, which is rather difficult since you can't put him on every front line since he's too weak and you lose too much gold moving him around to pinned in leaders) , I have great problems resisting the waves of skeletons.

I even created a Fire Drake in debug to help me out, and still very easily could have died.

I moved Dalfidor to the tower which gives 60% defense and this is possibly the best way I saw to improve rolls.

Definitely maybe a little balance issue...

Edit:
And get this... I debug created a Hurricane Drake and Necromancer and I was still almost defeated. I definitely think this scenario is too overpowered for medium difficulty.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby lotsofphil » July 7th, 2009, 2:51 pm

Heruka wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? I simply could not stop the waves of attackers after getting the staff from the ancient spirit.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? Perhaps when you awoke the ancient spirit, all the ghosts would rise up to help you. Maybe this would take the waves of skeletons off your back for a while.

...I have great problems resisting the waves of skeletons.


Heruka, I don't think I have my old saves/replays any more but based on my feedback above and my dim memory, try being more patient after you get the staff. Are you sitting on the village to heal and get good defense?

The only tough part was waiting in the little alcove after getting the lightning staff. Any more than 1 skeleton at once and the HP dwindled. I just sat on the village, taking one at a time and then moved out to get the leader.


If you post a replay/save I'll try and give more advice.

*edit* I found save/replay. They are from 1.7.0. The replay interrupts you with "this file is corrupted" but I was able to ignore that and see everything.
Attachments
DM-Houses_of_the_Dead_Turn_1.gz
1.7.0 medium
(25.06 KiB) Downloaded 302 times
DM-Houses_of_the_Dead_replay.gz
1.7.0 medium
(18.15 KiB) Downloaded 304 times
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Jarkko » February 23rd, 2010, 10:45 am

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
- Easy

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
- 6

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
- At first it was clear, but once I reached the signpost, I wondered why I hadn't won the scenario. I thought, it was a bug. Though the dialog suggested, that I must pick up the artifact, I didn't understand, it takes place on the same map. Maybe a new objective should be declared at that point, like "find the artifact and return to signpost".

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
- Interesting and quite enlightening. The story especially sheds a lot of light to the nature of the "afterlife" in Wesnoth universe.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
- Check section 3.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
- 8

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
- It's actually quite fun as it is

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
- There was a near-loss event, but a lucky strike saved.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
- Didn't check the code.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Max » March 18th, 2010, 8:35 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium (1.7.15)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
10 - unable to beat it without reloading a couple of times. maybe it's easier if delfador already was l4

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
a bit confusing, maybe i didn't read the dialogs carefully enough

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
quite nice

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
if you followed the secret path you're on your own and you need very good rolls

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8 - if it would be easier

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
let the ghosts attack only targets within range of delfador. they always tend to run/fly away and get killed. and make the secret passage bi-directional

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
see above

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
nice work

it looks like this scenario is broken, at least according to these comments:
Code: Select all
 # don't pick fights with the skeletons
 # try to get to Delfador and protect him
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby bobby » April 4th, 2010, 1:51 am

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Medium, 1.8.0

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) 6

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
First time I move Delfador to the signpost and nothing happened. Took me awhile to find the staff.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I like the dialogue with the undead spirits and creature, but the chamber dialogue was a little long.
Story was good, there's a sense of adventure moving through the cave/tunnel.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
First finding the staff. Then surviving the torrent of skeleton and the leader, because I didn't realize Delfador can recruit on the castle.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10) 7
It felt pretty repetitive with all the trial and error, but once I know the way and the plan it's fun.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe have the ghost tell you the right way initially so the player doesn't have to waste too much time walking to all corners of the cave. Being able to control the ghosts and ghoul and see what they see would be nice too.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Getting killed by the skeleton before I realized I need to find the chamber/staff, getting grounded down/killed in the chamber or just out of it because I didn't realize I can/need to recruit on death knight's keep.

Finished the scenario too early and didn't have enough gold for next scenario. The lack of early finish bonus means player will feel obliged to drag it out for gold and XP, which can be a bit repetitive.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Taimat » April 5th, 2010, 7:47 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Easy 1.8
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) 1
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? 'Find the signpost'. Can't really misinterpret that. Though if picking up the staff is required (As guy above said - I went exploring and found it anyway), that could get confusing.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? I liked it. The dead guys' texts in particular.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? None.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10) 6. Nice and easy, but the dialogue was good. Would have been better if it was harder.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? More skeletons. Don't know if I just got lucky, but the ghosts completely hammered the skeletons. I never had to fight anything. The only reason ANY of the ghosts died was because I tripped both villages while the death knight and two skeletons were around, then saw the staff and left them to it. Even then, they beat them all. The level was essentially me wandering around while ghosts flew into the shroud and killed stuff in my way. Far too easy, even for easy mode :/
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario? Nope.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Ilanin » April 6th, 2010, 6:45 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?

Mage, 1.8

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9ish.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Yeah, what everyone else says about the staff and the signpost.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Excellent - pretty much up to Northern Rebirth quality here which is a major compliment. Asking the same question three times is a bit of a cliché but forgivable.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The skeletons oh god the skeletons. Even with the staff and at level four Delfador will be ground down by them if they come at you two at a time. The solution, somewhat counter-intuitively, seems to be to take to the offensive - and quickly, before there are skeletons all over the place. I went in the front door, zapped one skeleton per two turns as they came to me (making sure never to move to a position where they could get the first shot) and prevented them from building up a numerical advantage. A nice puzzle.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

8 or so, though it would likely get boring if extended or repeated. Nice change of pace though.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

I'd prefer it if the ghosts didn't give actively bad tactical advice, since taking the back door seems like a really bad idea to me.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

Yeah, the first four times I tried to do what the ghosts told me to and got killed.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?

The WML is well-commented (and I love the aside about how the McGuffin guard is foreshadowing) though I'm not terribly sure that the ghosts do what the WML says ("not pick fights with the skeletons..." - well, mine did). Not quite as laughable as "Sisal is set to play cautiously" in NR12 mind.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby ScipioAfricanus » April 7th, 2010, 6:25 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium, version 1.8
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very, although I found the staff on my own without knowing that it was required
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Pretty good
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None really. I had Delfador at lvl 4, so that helped.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
12. I loved how different it was.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
It's great like it is.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
My first time attempt, right after I got the staff the death knight and one skeleton landed every hit on me so I died. Not much to be done about that though.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby cph » April 18th, 2010, 8:31 am

(1) Great Mage, 1.8.0; Delfador at L3.
(2) 9 - first attempt aborted, second attempt made with massive amounts of save-loading. Third attempt made without save/load but very lucky with allies leveling.
(3) Okay
(4) EPIC

When I reach the signpost, it tells me to go get an artifact because a ghost mentioned it. I don't remember a ghost mentioning it.

(5) Let's see:

  • the enemy recruits nearly 1 skeleton per turn, where I can't recruit at all.
  • my allies throw themselves suicidally at the enemy so I'm likely to arrive at his castle alone. Even if by chance one of the ally units does level up, it will die at the enemy castle in 1 combat round.
  • if Delfador arrives with less than perfect health at the enemy castle, he probably won't live through the fight. But the nearest village to his base to heal is ~3 moves away so I've got to kill several skeletons on my way from it to the castle, and the terrain doesn't give me a way into the villages by the enemy castle if he just parks a skeleton in the way (which he can do most turns).

To win at this skill, it seems essential to get lucky and have ally units level up.

(6) 10/10 if it wasn't so luck dependent - epic dialogue, great look and ambience; 6/10 as it is.
(7) Giving me control of even 1 allied unit out of this lot would reduce my save/load rate massively. Control of all of them and it's a walk perhaps... . A convenient staging post village by the signpost would give me a much better launching-off point (although since I can't keep the allies in check if they are in range of the enemy, perhaps that won't help me as much as I think).
(8) Delfador dying. Again, and again, and again.
Last edited by cph on April 18th, 2010, 8:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby cph » April 18th, 2010, 8:59 am

Looking at others' comments (I always post my own first), I should note that I didn't find the secret passage. Given that it's in one of a dozen valleys into the mountains, and I'm pressed by skeletons the whole time, I'm not surprised that I didn't stop to explore that one. I managed to beat the level on the third restart without finding it; if I had not done so, perhaps I would have gone looking again as it is pointed out in the dialogue (although I had explained that to myself by thinking that the transition to the paved path was the "backdoor".).

Changing my answers then (without replaying):

(6) I'll guess 8/10
(7) Not sure whether more hints about the backdoor are warranted or not. I wasn't anticipating a teleport-style passage - I had explored the mountains in the SW thoroughly on my first attempt so thought I knew there was no way in from the south.

I would remove the paved path and just make it all dirt paths, I don't see what the transition is there for, and it would have made me think more about whether the backdoor was a different way.

Edit: and I agree with another poster, restore the early exit bonus or remove the exit gold, so I don't have a reason to hang around ~20 turns to get an extra 250 gold for the next level.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Gerion » April 30th, 2010, 1:07 am

1) Medium
(2) 8. It ist quite difficult to keep Delfador alive, but once you get the knack, it is not so hard at all.
(3) The first objective is quite clear, but I am somewhat missing an objective update when learning about the staff. Actually, I stumbled across the staff by accident after finding the secret passage, I do not remember a dialogue in which the staff was mentioned. Maybe somewhere in the scenario a forced dialogue with an objective update would help
(4) I think the dialogues with the ghosts are good for ambience, everyone of them has its own story. That is interesting and a good idea
(5) keeping Delfador alive
(6) 8. It is interesting, has the "Dungeon Crawl" flavor on it and is a good idea
(7) Make the ghosts smarter. They tend to fly off and get killed because it is too far to go after them and help. Maybe if they only attack enemies close enough for Delfador to reach them, it would be more fun
(8) The swarm of skeletons after collecting the staff via secret passage was, because unexpected, quite deadly. After learning and fortifying himself in the village it was not so hard...
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby Benefuchs » May 18th, 2010, 10:09 pm

1) Medium, 1.8.0
(2) 8
(3) Just medium, it's a bit unclear where to walk
(4) Especially the ghosts' sentences are very cool. And that's why Delfador is the only mage to throw lightning instead of fireballs!
(5) Bad advice, see below.
(6) very cool athmosphere, but to difficult to be much fun.
(7) controlling the ghosts, letting the ghosts pass through the tunnel as well, make them act more reasonable, or something like that
(8) Following the ghosts' advice, I tried to visit every house, which slowed me down and allowed the creation of more skeletons, and used the secret tunnel. I ended up on the other side completely alone, all friendly ghosts were slain and I faced two skeletons at once later or earlyer. Resting in the village to heal did not help, because it gave the skeletons the first strike.
The only way to beat the scenario was to hurry behind the two or three ghosts I freed and immediately kill the skeleton they stopped. Most of them died, one leveled, and having killed the knight, I could take the staff.
(9) N.A.
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 9 - Houses of the Dead

Postby shadowblack » June 30th, 2010, 4:01 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
1.8.2, Mage (Normal/Medium/whatever you call it)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
Varies between 5 and 9 depending on luck.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Initally I was a bit confused, since I had absolutely no idea which way to go.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Very interesting. I loved it. But looking at the scenario code I see I missed a few things, such as:
- I never met Melinna
- I never got any of those “surprises”

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
1 – figuring out which way to go
2 – finding the secret passage
3 – surviving on my own after getting the staff

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8 – too many skeletons, otherwise ti would be 10

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Give the player control over the ghosts. Watching them attack the skeletons and get destroyed (or not watching them if the battle is outside Delfador’s sight range) is not fun. And allow Delfador’s allies to also use the secret passage.

Also, I was expecting an actual passage leading to the enemy castle, not a teleporter-style tunnel/mine, so I was a bit confused about this at first. Maybe make it clear that it is a tunnel, or at least hint what it does?

And last, but not least, Roddry did not mention anything about the magical artifact even though I was expecting him to (based on what another ghost says). Either make him mention the artifact, or make it clear that he knows more only about the passage.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
After all of my companions get killed I started over and decided to go in another direction. Didn’t make much difference.

After getting the staff Delfador was on his own and survived only because the enemy leader attacked him and thus Delfador was able to kill him. Still, all those skeletons coming back to say “hi” with Delfador having nowhere to go… I barely survived, thanks to some luck (must be compensation for my mages’ horrible accuracy in the previous 3 missions).


Overall, my favorite scenario so far.
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