The Rise of Wesnoth 17c - Troll Hole

Feedback for the mainline campaign The Rise of Wesnoth.

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Joram
Posts: 366
Joined: September 2nd, 2008, 5:36 am

Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by Joram » April 25th, 2009, 6:47 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
Hard 1.6.0

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

I came in with 492 gold.

6- I just needed to stand in one place killing the advancing waves; then advance for the finish.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Since when are Trolls green? :?

Oh, wait. I remember now. :mrgreen:

Also, it doesn’t sound natural for Burin to say “I indeed do”. It would be better “Indeed I do” or something else entirely.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Surviving the first waves. After that cleaning up.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5- There was a certain amount of satisfaction to be derived from actually making use of my Merman Hopilite’s Steadfast ability.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I’m not sure. Are four tests really necessary? Wouldn’t two or three do? I just got done half of the tests, and I’m not looking forward to two more.
The Fires of Pride 0.3, a heavily story based campaign.
On hold while I try and finish my book

KingsIndian
Posts: 11
Joined: June 6th, 2010, 12:14 am

Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by KingsIndian » June 6th, 2010, 2:38 pm

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
1.8.0, Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
7, but only because I went in well-prepared, with 457 Gold and lots of levelled Magi. However, my economy was dire: I had a non-income of -40 gold per turn at one point. Even thought I finished the level quite quickly, I'm short of gold for future scenarios.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Crystal.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It was OK.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
I kept having to saveload in order to save important units. The initial rush was hard too: my Great Mage was reduced to 2HP, although I did manage to save her without resorting to saveloading.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6. Not as bad as I had been expecting, considering some of the feedback given here. However, had I not been preparing for this scenario in advance, and been too proud to saveload, I don't think I would have enjoyed it at all.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? A bit more terrain that humans can actually move on. Also, maybe considering reducing the trolls' starting gold and increasing their base income: while I quite liked the challenge of the initial rush, it's clear from the feedback that quite a few people didn't. Also, perhaps hide some gold or a pick-up item somewhere to make all that exploring and those Giant Spiders worth it.

Non-Level 1 casualty report:

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shadowblack
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by shadowblack » August 22nd, 2010, 9:28 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.8.4, Commander (Normal)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5 – not really hard with the right troops and if you’re careful

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Fine.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Avoiding losses, since trolls hit hard.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6 – a nice little distraction

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe give a hint/warning that there might be something other than trolls down there – those spiders can be quite an nasty surprise.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No
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fenny
Posts: 39
Joined: August 19th, 2010, 2:22 pm

Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by fenny » August 22nd, 2010, 10:36 pm

1+2) I played it recently in 1.8.2 in medium difficulty and i found it more easy than some time ago, when i played it on easy. There are level 2 trolls in medium and level 1 trolls in easy, but in medium the number of trolls seems smaller, so you need less units and time to get through, and you earn more money for the next scenario. I would say 5.
3) clear
4) ok
5) get this damned cave spider killed to occupy more villages and earn more money
6) 7, i like it
7) nothing
8 ) no

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Maiklas3000
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Joined: June 23rd, 2010, 10:43 am

Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by Maiklas3000 » December 24th, 2010, 2:14 pm

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
Lord (challenging/hardest); 1.9.3; 252 starting gold (minimum is 200)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Excellent.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Keeping all loyals and criticals alive is difficult against a swarm of trolls.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
If it wouldn't be too much trouble, add a day/night cycle to the light splashes in the entry room (so they turn off at night.) And add a swarm of Vampire Bats timed to converge on the entry room at dusk. (They were planning to go out to feed.)

(8) Restarts?
Yes, lost many times, restarting from start, but no save-reloads.

(9) WML?
There aren't any comments to comment on.

(10) Replay?
Attached.

It was a sloppy victory. I lost most of my recruited Mages after they were almost ready to level. I almost lost a White Mage. I gambled my loyal Mage of Light to AMLA heal him. And I should have lost a Huntsman, who survived only because two trolls missed on all their attacks.
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line
Posts: 94
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by line » January 31st, 2013, 8:15 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Lord (Challenging) 1.10.3
256 starting gold, enemies: 200/200
Finished turn 27/33

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9. The walkthrough recommends to attack a troll with two own units when he marches the narrow passage. I tried not to get too heavy into negative income, so I recalled only two MoL. Then I wanted to optimize their positions, to have a maximum healing effect on most units guarding the passages, what ended up like that:
Troll Hole.pdf
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With that defence line you face only 6 trolls each round. You can attack only two of them with more than just one unit. That’s why you don’t kill too many trolls each round. So a lot of patience is necessary. As you have to wait for the troll flood to abate, it won’t be any earlier than half of the rounds before you can possibly start walking towards the trolls’ keeps. Contrary to the wiki the loyal IM were very helpful.
An alternative strategy might be, to stay at the own keep. The trolls would mostly step into water, making it easier to kill them. Also it would be possible to attack and kill more trolls per round. However, your defence line is much weaker, most of your units could possibly be attacked by two enemies – it would be a slaughter, so I did not pursue this way.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Green orcs? Also I did not like the childish “When did you plan to tell me that?” (What doesn't really belong to this scenario. This conversation always takes place in the first quest the player picks.)

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
I was lucky not to lose an arch mage in the end, when the troll leader left his keep. With more time left, it would have been possible to use Burin to spearhead both advances on the two troll leaders. Due to few time left (and to get at least a small carry over for the following scenario), I couldn’t wait for him. It’s very likely to lose a good unit here as well if meeting a spider.

Overall: Wearing the trolls down takes quite a while, than you march carefully through the cave with poor mobility (due to fog you can’t even see too far). Approaching the troll bosses you have to be extra careful (if you don’t fodder). All this has to be done with few units, because you can’t afford to have a big army. And if you try to improve your upkeep you will meet killer spiders.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6. I played this over and over to optimize the start and anything coming after. While playing you should always check if your units are within a troll’s range and able to survive both of his hits. There is few room to maneuver, it’s more like hedgehoging towards the enemies.
The third underground scenario – I hope this was the last one.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
When the trolls, who were both located north of me, used the southern entrances to reach my keep, I hoped for the spider to attack them – and was quite disappointed about the spider ignoring them. I guess on hard you can't expect hostile units to help you, therefore it's ok the way it is.

If there was more time to win the scenario I could imagine the spiders to automatically come to the player's keep (maybe about round 15) to attack in your back (the player could then occupy the villages next to the two spider castles and stabilize his economy). But as the scenario is really hard the way it is now, there is no need for such a change, which would make it even harder in the moment of the spiders attack.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
See (5). Lots of restarts.
Attachments
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Maiklas3000
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by Maiklas3000 » July 15th, 2014, 11:10 am

(1) Level and version? hard, 1.11.15, 200 starting gold (the minimum.)
(2) Difficult? 7.
(3) Objectives? Clear.
(4) Dialog? Green trolls?
(5) Challenges? This is not an easy scenario with minimum gold, but I made the most of my gold by recruiting some Peasants, who advanced rapidly. One almost made Halbierder! When the trolls are on diagonally opposite starting keeps, it is harder; I won that way, but lost two loyal Iron Maulers, so I replayed from start. This time it was with all the trolls in the north. I held them at bottlenecks, but they tried to flank, so briefly I was fighting at nearly every possible entrance to the room:
Wesnoth - TRoW - Troll Hole - chokepoints.jpg
I'm pretty pleased with the attached replay, except that on turn 15, I nearly got Lady Jessene killed when a Troll Warrior leader popped out of nowhere and bonked her on the head, along with two Troll Whelps.

I changed the walkthrough based on the previous review. Now I don't discourage use of the loyal Iron Maulers, but rather recommend caution if you use them.

I finished on turn 28/33 with positive gold and so good carryover.
(6) Fun? 9, a perfectly balanced scenario.
(7) Changes? No changes necessary.
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Theron
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by Theron » July 21st, 2014, 9:46 pm

difficulty: HARD / wesnoth version: 1.11.16

Stats:
Scenario, starting gold (default+carryover),turns/max turns,recruits-recalls-advancements-losses-kills
17-troll hole 200+182 31/33 2-11-4-1-69

Comments:
Done as 3. quest.
It’s hard to play with minimal risks because of the enemies movement costs of 1 in caves.
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taptap
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by taptap » April 19th, 2015, 10:20 pm

Lord / Challenging. 285 gold. Several tries from start. Finally decided to fight in the main hall using light and good terrain to full effect. Recalled/recruited my two(!) iron maulers, Sir Ruddry (30% armour against blunt damage), the loyal merfolk, a bandit, some thugs, footpads, some mages (not all levelled). Finished turn 23/33 w/ 180 carryover.

General interest: I managed to lure away one of the spiders and capture the villages in the area. With map knowledge this should be possible to pull off somewhat reliably with two footpads and less sacrifices than in my game.
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shadow12
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by shadow12 » February 7th, 2016, 3:58 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on? Lord, Wesnoth 1.10.5, iOS app ver 1.0.4. Ended on turn 14/33, Starting gold 266, Finishing gold -33, Carry over gold 230.
I did this #3 in the tests for Haldric to prove himself worthy.

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) 9
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? very clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? Very good.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Defeating the northern king.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
10+ Very fun! Liked the map with a pool of water surrounding the castle and the catacombs leading to the enemy kings.

I got a general idea of the two Troll kings' locations when the trolls start coming out. I set up chokepoints and used a triangle formation: healers at the back and veterans in the front, veterans such as the Dwarf, Royal Guards, Grand Knights, Halberdiers, Fugitives, etc. I didn't want to spend a lot time by the pool because I didn't want the trolls to have time recruiting, so I pushed forward into the tunnel right away. A few Mermen worked well to kill the calamari and any stray Trolls. The Assassin was surprisingly resilient to troll bonks, and he was crucial to quickly killing the big trolls. I wish I had more like him.

To defeat the spider, I used a Fugitive to sneak down to her lair. He was the only one who got close, I think that is why she didn't recruit any more spiders. She just sat there staring into the darkness with her 8 million eyes, while he quietly shuffled (unseen) from village to village. Then Zap! a Silver Mage teleported over and...faster than you can say, "Raid kills bugs dead" ...they killed the bug dead.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Great as is!
On turn 5 Haldric said, "Too bad this isn't going as well as the beach...I miss the beach." Seriously Prince, you sucked on the beach.
Sometimes life unexpectedly throws a Troll or a nasty Queen Naga in your path.

Thrash
Posts: 205
Joined: June 25th, 2010, 1:54 pm

Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by Thrash » January 28th, 2018, 2:33 pm

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on? 

1.12.6, Normal

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) 

5, surviving the initial assault is the hardest part - if trolls manage to gang up they can kill L3s.

The spider and enemy leaders can also kill significant units if you aren't careful.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? 

Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? 

Where did my loyal knight go?

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? 

Initial uncertainty of where the trolls will be coming from. Keeping them from ganging up on units.

The light patches are interesting. I don't feel I figured out how to effectively use them and instead used terrain as I normally would.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10) 

7, the random placement of the enemy and the light patches are interesting additions to the standard defend and crush paradigm.

The tentacles are also a nice touch. They seem to attack at random times? Or when you hit certain locations?

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

Maybe have more tentacles appear throughout the scenario?

Someone else made the suggestion of the light patches changing with time of day. They could also move as the sun moves across the sky.
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Aldarisvet
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Re: The Rise of Wesnoth: Troll Hole

Post by Aldarisvet » July 9th, 2018, 9:27 pm

Here are replays of an unthinkable thing - passing The Rise of Wesnoth campaign on hardest difficulty recruiting only Mages.
The game version is 1.12.6
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