South Guard 7b. Pebbles in the Flood

Feedback for the mainline campaign The South Guard.

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Developers

Linthar
Posts: 77
Joined: September 14th, 2006, 12:16 am

Re: South Guard 7b. Pebbles in the Flood

Post by Linthar » August 6th, 2014, 3:15 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
Soldier (aka the highest difficulty) 1.10.7

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
??? out of 10. I'm really not sure how to rate a scenario that in one sense is impossible to win, but in another sense is impossible to lose (since you will always go on to the next level), and in a third sense your performance still matters either way. If I had to rank it I would probably give it a 10 just because I have no idea how its possible to last 24 turns to get the full benefits the walkthrough mentions.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Deoran's first line doesn't make a lot of sense. He says
We have escaped the great forest, but look! The undead are chasing us - we must not have rooted them all out of the wood
but he already knew that he hadn't rooted them all out of the wood. At the end of scenario 5 he learned he couldn't actually reach the real Mebrin, and then he spent the entire next scenario running away from the undead. So why is he acting like the undead chasing them is a surprising thing. Other then that the dialog was pretty well done.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
You start with 100 gold, and no recall list. One of your enemys starts with 400 gold, 100 or so base income, and is recruiting level 3 skeletons. The map is mostly wide open terrain that allows your enemies to make full use of their vastly superior numbers. No matter what you do the enemy is going to completely overrun any attempt at making a defensive line.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6. It's an interesting concept for a scenario, but it's kind of ruined a bit by just how overwhelming the enemy force is. There isn't a lot of strategy you can actually use since attempting to fight back will likely just get you killed faster, and it just comes down to figuring out whatever tricks buy you another turn or two of life, like never using any attack they would allow the enemy to counter, or making a run for the mountains to buy an extra turn or 2 before the enemy can catch you.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The difficulties too front loaded. Instead of the enemy recruiting a massive army at the start, I'd have the initial forces be weak, but steadily ramp up over time. That way you can actually be fighting the enemy until they gradually become too strong to beat, instead of having an immediately overwhelming enemy army force your units sit in a ball, never attacking to ensure they suffer no counter attacks, and die as slow as possible.

idiotdriver
Posts: 1
Joined: December 4th, 2014, 9:33 am

Re: South Guard 7b. Pebbles in the Flood

Post by idiotdriver » December 4th, 2014, 9:48 am

Hi there I'm new :D
(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
1. medium 1.10.7
2. first 20 turns 4 then like zero for the rest* (more on that)
3. very clear objectives
4. okay (I like it short and sweet)
5. keeping units alive when they are all paper thin
6. 6 fun
7. max turn limit, and maybe a way to stop us sticking a unit in the corner so that only the other team can use some of the edge tiles

*eventually sent gerrick to top left corner. he was 1xp from levelling and the dead were afraid to attack. After Mal M Brin had his max army size surrounding me I ended it by attacking myself. Think the exploit is more of an ai problem and it may have been patched in the newer builds.

nikita1996
Posts: 47
Joined: July 18th, 2015, 8:07 am

Re: South Guard 7b. Pebbles in the Flood

Post by nikita1996 » December 23rd, 2015, 10:46 am

Content Feedback wrote:(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(1) v1.12.5 Hard
(2) I don't know how to value it. Maybe -1 or 11.
(3) Very clear.
(4) The dialogue is really sad and even makes people cry! Such a great warrior who have fighted in the south of Wesnoth for a long time, is going to die with no doubt.. But, the Chinese translation is really bad (I'm Chinese user) and not as moving as the English edition.
(5) First, to kill Mal Tera in the second turn. Second, to let Gerrick flee to the corner of the map at last.(I failed to do this at last and I holded only 13 turns.)
(6) 5. I think this is really a special task I have never met. But, I think there should be a maximum turn limit. Deoran have promised to save Gerrick so he will gradually come. Also, I think we should make "impossible" into "possible" in some way. In the view of psychology, hope is somewhat very important that can encourage people hold longer and longer. So if there is even a little bit hope, the game will be much more fun.
(7) The game says that it's impossible to win at all, but I don't believe it at all! I think there are at least 2 ways to "win". The first one is mentioned above. That is to let Gerrick have only 1xp to level, and the AI will be fear to attack. So Gerrick will live as long as you want. The second one is, to surround Mal M'Brin(the boss) in turn 3 and don't let him go back to his castle. Then rapidly kill all other enemies in the following few turns. At last, put Gerrick into Mal M'Brin's castle(the castle locates on the southeast) and recurit one peasant per turn. Mal M'Brin will kill one peasant each turn and then a new peasant will follow on. At the end of each turn, Mal M'Brin is always surrounded by 6 peasants and cannot move at all. Mal M'Brin have much more money than you, but he will never reach his castle since turn 3. Althrough these two ways are very very difficult, there's still a little bit hope. So, a maximum turn limit is very important.

Tip: I successfully surrounded Mal M'Brin in turn 3 but he has 100% defense rate in fact, so I couldn't hurt him at all. Maybe I should "win" in the second way mentioned above, but I couldn't fight that well. I couldn't kill other enemies in the following 5 turns and stop Mal from getting back to the castle. However, I believe that winning is possible!
TSG-Pebbles_in_the_Flood_replay.bz2
(29.23 KiB) Downloaded 100 times
Attachments
wesnoth_NR_Pebbles_in_the_Flood_cant_kill_the_boss.png

wesnothgamer2000
Posts: 1
Joined: November 6th, 2017, 10:33 am

Re: South Guard 7b. Pebbles in the Flood

Post by wesnothgamer2000 » November 6th, 2017, 10:47 am

nikita1996 wrote:
Content Feedback wrote:(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(1) v1.12.5 Hard
(2) I don't know how to value it. Maybe -1 or 11.
(3) Very clear.
(4) The dialogue is really sad and even makes people cry! Such a great warrior who have fighted in the south of Wesnoth for a long time, is going to die with no doubt.. But, the Chinese translation is really bad (I'm Chinese user) and not as moving as the English edition. Why didn't you hire some real professional mandarin linguists to provide a truly touching version?
(5) First, to kill Mal Tera in the second turn. Second, to let Gerrick flee to the corner of the map at last.(I failed to do this at last and I holded only 13 turns.)
(6) 5. I think this is really a special task I have never met. But, I think there should be a maximum turn limit. Deoran have promised to save Gerrick so he will gradually come. Also, I think we should make "impossible" into "possible" in some way. In the view of psychology, hope is somewhat very important that can encourage people hold longer and longer. So if there is even a little bit hope, the game will be much more fun.
(7) The game says that it's impossible to win at all, but I don't believe it at all! I think there are at least 2 ways to "win". The first one is mentioned above. That is to let Gerrick have only 1xp to level, and the AI will be fear to attack. So Gerrick will live as long as you want. The second one is, to surround Mal M'Brin(the boss) in turn 3 and don't let him go back to his castle. Then rapidly kill all other enemies in the following few turns. At last, put Gerrick into Mal M'Brin's castle(the castle locates on the southeast) and recurit one peasant per turn. Mal M'Brin will kill one peasant each turn and then a new peasant will follow on. At the end of each turn, Mal M'Brin is always surrounded by 6 peasants and cannot move at all. Mal M'Brin have much more money than you, but he will never reach his castle since turn 3. Althrough these two ways are very very difficult, there's still a little bit hope. So, a maximum turn limit is very important.

Tip: I successfully surrounded Mal M'Brin in turn 3 but he has 100% defense rate in fact, so I couldn't hurt him at all. Maybe I should "win" in the second way mentioned above, but I couldn't fight that well. I couldn't kill other enemies in the following 5 turns and stop Mal from getting back to the castle. However, I believe that winning is possible!
TSG-Pebbles_in_the_Flood_replay.bz2
"The Chinese translation is so bad" - couldn't agree more! It lost the feel that the original language was able to deliver and make impact. This needs to be improved!

Konrad2
Posts: 809
Joined: November 24th, 2010, 6:30 pm

Re: South Guard 7b. Pebbles in the Flood

Post by Konrad2 » May 7th, 2018, 9:45 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?

1.14.0, Soldier (Normal)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

7, having so little of an anti-undead army goes a long way for increasing the difficulty.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Pretty clear, survive as long as possible.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

It was awesome. That bandit going down with me...

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

How about the undead armies? xD Jokes aside, not being hung up on defending the Border Camp. It's decently defensible, but hardly optimal.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

It was an 8 or 9 for me. Because damn. Watch that replay and try telling me they didn't die as heroes. HEROES.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

Somehow tell the player how much he has achieved by surviving until this turn (every turn after turn 6)
Attachments
TSG-Pebbles in the Flood replay.gz
I might have been just a pebble, but damn, I was a stubborn pebble.
(42.76 KiB) Downloaded 9 times
I am a Ghost: I drain the life energy from other people to survive and am hated/feared by regular people. Non-regular people don't like me either though.

Post Reply