Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

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Ninjuri
Posts: 167
Joined: April 28th, 2012, 2:59 am
Location: California

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by Ninjuri » May 4th, 2012, 6:37 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
easy 1.10.2
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
very
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
it was ok
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
This was was a tough banana for me, even with the holy water. I failed miserably on my first try, so i had to start over and plan out my unit positioning to specifically counter what each lich was spawning. Even then, i had to make heavy use of my leader units, who took a beating especially near the end. I barely managed to make it.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Make the holy water more visible, i could hardly tell a difference if i didn't look at the specific before/after damage. Also maybe cut the lichs starting gold, instead giving them some increased income, so they're not all swamping me at once, but sending just a few units at a time in a stream, to alleviate some of the difficulty (especially since i was on easy mode to begin with).
Fate is against me.

chefan
Posts: 1
Joined: June 22nd, 2012, 7:03 pm

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by chefan » June 22nd, 2012, 7:10 pm

Content Feedback wrote:(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
clear enough
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
good
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
finding the right balance of blocking screen and the proper task force to assassinate the liches
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
none

Bishop
Posts: 1
Joined: July 6th, 2012, 11:31 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by Bishop » July 6th, 2012, 11:50 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
medium 1.10.3
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear enough, survive or try to kill the liches
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
par for the course
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
just trying to hold off the T2 undead. almost all of the wraiths hit at the same time, even with several level 2s and 3s it was hard to defend and I still lost a lot of units. I had to shuffle units around in my castle to keep some from getting killed, and while some leveled up I probably lost more than I got. I cleared most of the undead by the end of turn 9 and was able to rush konrad, and an archmage to one lich and delfador and the T3whitmage to another while a Grand Knight with holy water was sent to another and managed to kill all three liches on turn 12. Not really an early finish, and I had to reload the knights attack several time because I needed both charges to hit, but it was pretty fun and I was able to do it without hiding in a corner which I now realize would have been easier.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
If you dont try to save everyone and roll with the punches I'd say8, because it is fun to deafeat such overwhelming odds.

I've attached the replay if anyone wants to see it
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Attachments
HttT-The_Valley_of_Death_—_..._replay.gz
(43.12 KiB) Downloaded 245 times

Yoba
Posts: 1
Joined: August 2nd, 2012, 2:25 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by Yoba » August 2nd, 2012, 3:14 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Hard 1.10.2
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very Clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It was clear, but not very interesting. Could be better at explaining things like why all the lich must be killed to stop their minions.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Several: I did'nt want to get upgraded units killed so getting the right strategy for this, and doing it in a way they get distracted instead of chasing the main hero was a pain in the ass. Everytime i take him out of the fort the liches armies chased him and dedicated only few forces to deal with my cannonfodder distraction groups. After several restarts i decided to go with 1 horsemen and 1 paladin to kill the top and right lich, and mermen and elven fighters cannonfoder to hold the forest and the castle leaving our main hero in the castle. The elven hero picked up the south holywater and with the help of the white wizards i killed the final lich, in the same turn they would have killed Konrad and the oldwizard. (all my cannonfodder died)
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
It's really frustrating, but the challenge make it fun once i got it right.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I would nerfed it a bit in one way and make it thoughter in another: when someone kills one lich their army tuns to dust or something like that. And the AI should withdraw some units from the attacks for defense when they see their castle is getting attacked.(this would balance the other change)
Attachments
HaT-El_Valle_de_la_muerte_—..._repetición.gz
Valle de la Muerte
(47.88 KiB) Downloaded 222 times

devavrata
Posts: 73
Joined: August 30th, 2012, 8:59 pm

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by devavrata » September 16th, 2012, 1:18 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Battle for Wesnoth 1.8.3, Easy/Medium/Hard
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
Quite difficult to kill the three liches, 9
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
-
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
On hard, time is very tight. You've got to kill and move non-stop. Even so, to kill the three liches would be unattainable without knights
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
Not so fun because of the time pressure.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
-

Zmoj
Posts: 13
Joined: October 6th, 2012, 6:04 pm

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by Zmoj » October 6th, 2012, 6:21 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on? Easy, 1.10.3
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) 6
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Easy to understand
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? It was good except for ending, there should be difference from survive and killing lichs win
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? Protecting valuable units that are Lvl. 2 and higher
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10) 5
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? No changes

TeeWee
Posts: 7
Joined: August 1st, 2012, 9:17 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by TeeWee » October 11th, 2012, 3:39 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Normal on iPad version (1.6.3 in the about)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
6

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear. Survive for the turns or kill all liches

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I find the reaction to the Princess (this scenario and the previous one) offputting and childish. It was clear though.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Ralising that you don't have to hold to the fort, but can move away as well. Thiss made the scenario easy. It allowed me to meet the eastern wraiths in favourable time of day, rolling up the zombies and the rest of east by night, delaying the arrival of the heavy hitting skeletons to the second day, blunting their attack severely. These aspects all made the scenario much easier than expected. On my second try, granted. First try had me trying a doomed defense in the central keep.

In the end, i only lost cannon fodder and managed to level up two fresh mages.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I would add some dialogue to explain why, after two days, the power of the liches would be broken. As I trounced their forces in the end, it didn't matter, but for an almost hopeless defense, it wouldn't make sense.

Noxos
Posts: 19
Joined: February 20th, 2013, 2:36 pm

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by Noxos » February 23rd, 2013, 8:10 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9 at first, but once I figured out a "trick" I'd say more like 3.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It was ok, the holy water part was not clear though (how it works etc). I only even picked it up on accident.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Figuring out that moving out was much better than trying to hold the fort you start in. Trying to take out all 3 liches before Konrad gets overrun. I have yet to figure that one out (I just ended up surviving but had no bonus gold). I could probably do it if I had some knights, but unfortunately I lost all of mine on scenario 6. Wraiths are definitely the biggest problem.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5. Though that's partly my own fault, because I resorted to thief spam to survive. Basically got about 25 thieves and then retreated through the north west of the map. The lake slows down the undead coming from the south and east while the mountain range slowed down the guys from the north, this also ended up resulting in my only having to face wraiths, since all the other units were bottled up. I took thieves because they're dirt cheap, disposable, and have the best defense in plains and mountains. It did feel satisfying coming up with a plan that worked, but it was a lot of busywork moving around and rotating so many thieves in a massive moving retreat.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
None that I can think of.

Ninjamestari
Posts: 7
Joined: April 15th, 2013, 10:42 pm

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by Ninjamestari » April 15th, 2013, 10:59 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
-Medium, version 1.10.6
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
-8, it was pretty difficult. I just started playing a few days ago though.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
-Very clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
-No complaints there. I liked how in the end the undead had almost no forces left and they stop attacking at new dawn.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
-Figuring out a working strategy, because I didn't use a walkthrough. First I just tried to assassinate the Liches with some elite units while holding off the undead with others, and after that I tried to turtle in my starting castle. After failing many times I decided to recruit a ton of mages and some of my veterans and rush the eastern Lich's castle and barricade myself in there. Lost some veteran units but also got some more experienced mages.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
-10, I'd say it was the funniest scenario so far.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
-Wouldn't change anything, it feels fun and balanced. Killing all three Liches might be hard with so little time available but I didn't seriously try to do that.

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lord_joakim
Posts: 14
Joined: November 11th, 2008, 9:53 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by lord_joakim » May 11th, 2013, 11:58 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium. 1.10.5
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9 before I realized I should just conquer the southwest.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
It was very clear, but it was unclear in regards to how it was possible. The elven holy water tip was a horrible one.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
The setting was pretty good, but the Princess shouldn't make that childish obvious hint in the latest scenario. Rather, have the characters realize in this scenario that they were trapped. Basically, the overarching story was not as forced as elements earlier in HttT, but the dialog was still pretty weak.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The holy water was a suicidal cause overall and there was practically no return for the risk. I found it a noob trap and only succeeded when I gave up on it completely. It worked best for me to bullrush the southeastern lich and then just hold it there, and then it suddenly became rather easy.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
Well, I didn't find it particularly fun. There were never really any complex tactics necessary when you realized what to do on the strategic level. The dialog in the end was actually really relieving and provided a sense of archievement, but until then I did all sorts of insane attempts to survive by going east, staying still while simply filling the moat with Merfolk, running for the holy water etc., and it was all futile things that were presented as a possibility by the terrain. I think the castle terrain could need some work. There are no choke points that makes standing still a possibility. I'd like to be able to go in more directions. But 4 for the sense of danger that lacked in a few other scenarios. Made for some interesting variation, to say the least.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Again, work a little on the terrain and the dialog. Also, I have no coding experience, but it would be really rewarding in return of the risk to allow the Arcane holy water equipment to be permanent. As it is, the scenario just feels like a big masochistic punishment. :p

vanatteveldt
Posts: 16
Joined: March 21st, 2009, 12:20 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by vanatteveldt » August 10th, 2013, 8:32 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
medium, 1.10.4

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
8. Just completed it on second try with some minor initial reloads to get build order right.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
To be honest, I don't really care much about the dialog/storyline.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Figuring out the right strategy. In the end I recruited 4 new elves to create a suicidal diversion in the woods while my main army went south. I lost only 2 units from my main army but I did lose all my gold since I had huge upkeep and almost no villages until the end. I have no idea how to improve this except for more restraint on the recruiting, but you really do need quite a number of units to fend off the onslaught...

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8. I liked it quite a bit since it forces you into a more defensive play, and it is the first scenario that forced me to use the day/night cycle. I feel it probably made me a better player.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
To make it more clear, I would mention that there are two holy water bottles on the map. I only found the second on a hint from the forum.
To make it more fun, I would increase the time to three days, as two days seems enough to beat off the undead, but if you gain the upper hand in the second day it is a shame that the scenario ends.

SBak
Posts: 78
Joined: October 8th, 2011, 1:36 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by SBak » October 3rd, 2013, 3:37 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Easy and medium 1.8.5, 1.10.2 and 1.10.5

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
This is variable (especially on Easy) depending on how much gold you come into the scenario with, what you can recall, and the enemy AI but varies between 9-10 and a 6.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Quite clear..

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Not very.. We know that the evil Queen has allied with the Orcs to impose her new regime which is generally upsetting everyone. We also know that in Elensefar the Orcs allied with the Undead (probably because the Trolls were taking a day off) and that the spoilt brat Princess is chasing Konrad and co, then all of a sudden they come to a valley where they are set upon by a strong band of the Undead? What's more, there's no swamp anywhere to be seen.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
This is a scenario which seems to require Paladins, lots of them, but on Easy unless you've been herding Horsemen and Knights round like buffalo you're unlikely to have more than one or two. Trying to play defensively and stay in your keep doesn't work either as the Undead will come at you from all three directions and pick off your units.

I'm also someone who isn't usually convinced by the need for holy water as I've never really been that aware of any great difference it makes to a units melee attacks. Here you find two bottles of the stuff waiting for you, north west and south east. For a quick Knight it's approximately three moves there and back to the stuff in the north west which risks being tagged by an enemy Wraith coming down from the north (if it's a quick one) or getting back to the southern offensive too late.

If I haven't had that good a campaign I'll usually try to head south and take out the southern Undead leader, but if things have gone somewhat better I've usually dealt with southern and eastern forces and much of whatever comes from the north. I've never managed to defeat all three enemy leaders. Once I got close, but Kalenz was too far away and Delfador only had half his hitpoints and I decided it wasn't worth the risk against a healthy Lich, given the inconsistency of the Red Mage lines against Liches.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
This is usually quite good fun even if things aren't going that well, so I'd say an 8.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I'm not so sure whether this scenario needs to change or not given the general criticism of levelling and balancing. I would consider myself an intermediate player - my knowledge is mainly theoretical and my main challenge consistently is putting what I know to enough practical use to effectively win scenarios. The campaign centres around playing Elves which are a pretty coordinated bunch of units. I'm of the opinion that while, like Dwarves, they are very terrain dependent, unlike Dwarves they tend to fare somewhat better out of their preferred terrain but also unlike Dwarves they don't level up so easily.

This is my main criticism mainly of the Easy level - you tend to get fewer enemies than the other levels, often your allies are stronger, so you less proportionately less chances to kill, less hitpoints and it's harder to level up units. So far in this campaign we've met the Undead three times - on Muff Malal's Peninsula (or Isle of the Damned), again in the Siege of Elensefar and here again and each time the enemies change as regards to level, so you're dealing with level2 Wraiths having never encountered a Ghost and the level 2 Skeleton lines.

I feel that increasing the difficulty on the Easy level needs to be dependent more on the quantity of enemies faced rather than their quality, which would require a player to have to develop very basic gameplay skills to the degree of being able to consistently develop a strong recall list.

mikerm
Posts: 1
Joined: January 27th, 2014, 3:44 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by mikerm » January 27th, 2014, 3:50 am

I managed to win this one (just) by a different strategy from any of those described in the walkthrough. I headed north, behind the mountains, leaving a couple of mermen and a couple of elvish fighters behind to slow down pursuit. Kept mostly in a block with the characters who must not be killed in the middle, thieves on the outside (I also had several higher-level thiefy types and a white mage). All three lots of enemy still attacked, but I managed to delay their full force long enough to get into the mountains in the north-west with my back to the wall where they couldn't attack all at once, and held out long enough to finish the scenario.

dinovan
Posts: 1
Joined: February 4th, 2014, 7:52 am

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by dinovan » February 4th, 2014, 7:57 am

1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9 (trying to hold the middle), then 4 after checking the read through
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Easy to follow and a fun mission
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
In the end I used two knights and holy water to knock out north and east bosses, both one hit kills
Everyone else went south and I left some thieves behind to slow the advance
Worked like a charm, completed in 8 turns (would have been quicker except one of my knights got slowed down by some Wraiths)
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe one more bottle of holy water somewhere SW

line
Posts: 94
Joined: January 11th, 2012, 9:21 pm

Re: Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

Post by line » May 20th, 2014, 9:15 pm

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Champion (Challenging) 1.11.12, Shamans only (and loyals)
394 starting gold, enemies: 440 / 600 / 400
Finished turn 12/12

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
The shaman line works pretty well against undead. I used the strategy to kill the southwestern leader and wait for the other undead to get there.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None. Chocobones are always a threat to kill a veteran.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
It's amazing that this scenario looks unbeatable at the first glance. But using the right strategy it's quite easy.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
None.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
None. The loss of a shyde would have been a reason to restart for me, 'cause I can't stand loosing veterans. But I lost enough time playing 1.11.6 until I realised all replays are broken.
Attachments
HttT-The_Valley_of_Death_—_..._replay.gz
shamans only
(67.79 KiB) Downloaded 113 times

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