Scenario 7: Crossroads

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Scenario 7: Crossroads

Post by Content Feedback » September 29th, 2004, 11:57 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
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turin
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Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by turin » September 29th, 2004, 12:14 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
easy (a long time ago) and medium (recently).
Dave wrote:(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
a while ago, 3. now, 10. i'm stuck on it. (mostly because i haven't played it a lot, but still...)
Dave wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear enough... defeat the more powerful enemy leader. But its odd you only have to defeat one of two, and a certain one...
Dave wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
The scenario IIRC didn't have much dialogue... it wasn't memorable, anyway.
Dave wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
if you go along the path, the orcs come at you from the sides and get you, if you go across, the ambushes get you. Its really hard to get close to the leader...
Dave wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
3/10. its not fun getting slaughtered every time I play, but the ambushes make it kind of interesting.
Dave wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Not have it be completely hills? Maybe some mountains, or more grass... orcs go 1 in hills, you don't, and that is what kills me.
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Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by Integral » September 29th, 2004, 1:04 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Reasonably clear. Because I had played earlier versions of the scenario, I killed both leaders the first time I encountered the new version, but that obviously isn't a problem with the scenario :).
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I'm not quite clear why the crossroads are there, but whatever. It's just an excuse to kill orcs anyway...
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The only reasonable strategy I've come up with is to hang around the starting location for a few days, until the computer gets its courage up to send most of its "first wave" of units against me (which, of course, I slaughter). This is rather expensive, and makes the next level tricky :?.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
4 - I don't like having to sit around for a while trying to lure the computer out of the hills.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Less hills -- trying to go north before you deal with the Orcs is suicide at the moment!

Daniel

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Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by Fortify » September 29th, 2004, 2:16 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
1. Medium
2. 6
3. Very clear
4. Dialog was clear but I ddin't understand why the crossroads were of specific significance other than they were a likely spot to be ambushed (and you are).
5. Discipline to stay out of the hills. Discipline to not exploit learning where ambushes were (in the version before random ambushes). Advance far enough and hold just enough so that enough of your units can burst through on the 2nd day to reach the 'objective leader' before the other orcs reach you.
6. 8 it is good as it forces you to play differently.
7. Use the random ambushes or a combo of set ambushes in key locations with less likely random ambushes. The random ones need to be less severe, maybe only 2 ambushers.
Last edited by Fortify on September 29th, 2004, 2:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by Ewan » September 29th, 2004, 2:17 pm

Chiming in here just because my experience on this level seems so diifferent to everyone else's.
Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
Easy, medium. 1, 3. I just have not seen the problems that others have: the NW leader's troops rarely play much of a role, as they tend to be a lot of grunts and whelps who either are too slow or stick to the hills (in fear?) after the initial wolf riders come in. I don't trigger ambushes, but just march along (usually two castles of folks, heavy on ranged combat) to the NE. It really does feel as though I am playing a different scenario to others!
Dave wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Fine. Odd but fine (i.e. isn't the guy that you don't kill just going to be in your rear?)
Dave wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Don't recall much. Probably clear but uninteresting. The ambush-warners work well.
Dave wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None really; requires more care in making sure that units are not left vulnerable to being ganged up on than do most scenarios, but basically easy.
Dave wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6-7. I think it's too simple, really, but that's clearly a minority opinion, and the ambush coding works really nicely. Plot relevance is minimal.
Dave wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I think I would have the ambush warnings triggered by the first ambush (which might be minimal, but if it occurs near starting castle, should not be a problem as the player will vastly outnumber it) so that there's at least one ambush to give interest. Otherwise a player sticking to the path may find this just a bit boring.

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Post by Rhuvaen » September 29th, 2004, 2:42 pm

1 - difficulty level: played on medium

2 - difficulty: 7 (needed three tries to succeed)

3 - objectives: clear enough, although it is not clear how to succeed in achieving them in the situation (sit and wait, letting the first wave come, or charge ahead). It's also not clear why there's such a need for haste (the strict turn limit).

4 - dialogue: sufficient and good at hinting at the ambushes

5 - challenge: finding what strategy will work. The first time I got slaughtered by night trying to get past the crossroads, with circling units caught in ambushes :roll: .
The second time I backtracked all the way back to the starting keep and let the first wave come, but unlike Daniel's game they took a long time during the daylight to just sit and wait in the hills. Turns ran out before I got anywhere near the leader (or I got Konrad killed in a mad rush, can't remember).
The third time I prepared at the crossroads for the night, survived mostly intact, and while holding the northwestern orc's troops with two powerful units pushed my forces towards the northeast where the northeastern orc's forces where backing off. I was lucky that the leader came out of his castle to attack me the second night :).
The hardest part was keeping all three leaders safe from harm while being forced to use especially Delfador and Kalenz against the enemy to keep moving (esp. that second night) - it's all very risky business. Also it was hard to protect against being surrounded without triggering an ambush, which just makes things worse!

6 - fun: [EDIT: raised the fun factor in retrospect] 8. This one makes you think very hard where to move each unit, and how to press your advance! Lots of tension, and not a lot of room where to move - I enjoyed that.

7 - what to change: for one, I think it would be great to have a little more time. Not enough to just sit in the fort for the orcs to come (boring), but just a little more so you don't have to make such risky moves with your leaders. And maybe shroud the map, the layout of the roads are very clear so players wouldn't get lost, and it would add to the atmosphere of tension and ambush. Anyway, it's better not to see what's coming at you when you just need to push forward :wink: .

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Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by Burnsaber » September 29th, 2004, 3:17 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
1.Medium
2. 4(Seriosly!) I just advanced with a tight grouo of my uber.units backed by couple healers. The orcs didn`t attack, only stayed in the hills, giving me free route to his leader....
3. very clear
4. There weren´t too much dialogue :?
5. To have the discipline to stay on the road....
6. 5
7. You could make the road one-hex wider...
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Post by Dacyn » September 29th, 2004, 9:03 pm

1=Easy
2=3[1]
3=somewhat
4=very, but together Loflar and Nioden's messages seem redundant.
5=Konrad dying
6=7
7=It seems good except that the signpost in the middle doesn't say anything... maybe it should say something simple like 'Crossroads'?

[1]I played without randomized ambushes :twisted:

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Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by daloser » September 29th, 2004, 10:42 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
1 - E
2 - 5 My first time playing this was really hard, I almost gave up on the whole Wesnoth thing. But for some reason since then I have never had any serious trouble with it.
3 - Clear
4 - Okay
5 - Discipline (as others have said) and deciding if I want to get more XP by taking on both leaders or be sensible and win the scenario quickly by doing the bare minimum.
6 - 9 Even tho I don't like the feeling that I'm being "herded" by the designer, you are not really forced to stay on the path. I like the fact that you can be disciplined and stick to the path - easy; or, if you have a lot of gold, try to be more aggressive, risk a few ambushes, capture some towns and go after both leaders. You have plenty of turns to try the latter. Maybe this only works when playing on "easy" though.
7 - Nothing. I like it.

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Post by allover » September 30th, 2004, 11:18 pm

1. Easy

2. 3 - I played it on my first run through the game and won it with maybe two tries. Of course, I was on easy, but I really didn't know what I was doing. I just ran for the NE orc, sending a couple of disposable units randomly off in all directions. Enough enemy troops chase them that the NW orc doesn't bother me, and the NE orc has his troops so dispersed that once I get past the first line by nuking them with Kalenz and Delfador I just ignore his troops and go kill him. Of course I don't get much experience, but I didn't realize then how important that was.

3. Very clear - none of the objectives I've seen have been confusing, per se. A few of the choices seem strange - I have no information to go on, or even no idea that there is a choice - but that doesn't happen here. What's not so clear is why I actually have to kill the orc leader. If all I have to do is get past the ambush, why does the scenario require me to kill him? (I'll probably have to anyway, and even if not, I'll probably want to). If I need him dead, why don't I need the other one dead too?

4. Pretty clear; I like the ambush guys, although it's not obvious why there are two (or where they come from; there are no other elves nearby, and they're not mine...).

5. Keeping moving required me to use Kalenz and Delfador to blow away enemies; keeping them alive was hard when I couldn't screen the flanks without going into the hills. Generally, it was hard to surround enemies without going into the hills. (I was playing with deterministic ambushes, though, so I soon used the safe hill squares, particularly putting a guy on the village near the signpost to draw fire). I often wished for concurrent movement: the road is packed and I want these two guys to switch places.

6. 7 - It forced me to use different tactics. I'm sort of used to xconq/freeciv/*craft strategies: maximize unit production by holding as many resources as possible; simply fend off the opponent until you have overwhelming force to squash him with. So I like scenarios that force very different strategies. This one, in particular really forced me to think about small-scale tactics: I could only ever use a few units at a time to bear the brunt.

7. No suggestions 'til I've finished the campaign.

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Post by ott » October 2nd, 2004, 9:38 am

Relative to wesnoth-0.8:

(1) Levels: medium, easy, hard

(2) Difficulty: 3-8, depending on strategy chosen

(3) Objectives: clear

(4) Dialog/storyline: clear

(5) Challenges: if killing the NW leader first with a united force, it is difficult to finish within the turn limit. (It then pays to go into the hills to trigger ambushes: relieves the tedium of marching to the NE, and increases XP gain.) If rushing to the NE, it seems reasonably easy to achieve the objective (on hard). However, with only 40% defense, for this strategy low level units seem to be good only as cannon fodder, with L3 units being crucial -- this doesn't leave much room for unit advancement.

(6) Fun: 8, a nice set piece.

(7) Changes: randomized ambushes would have been nice, as per the later versions of the game -- the isolated villages with 100% chance of ambush made it difficult to build an economy to sustain an XP-maximizing strategy.

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Post by Glowing Fish » October 5th, 2004, 6:35 am

1. Easy
2. 7 or 8
3. At first, I wasn't sure that I only had to kill the NE orc
4. Clear, although there wasn't much
5. Staying alive. I only had a 100 gold to start with, which means I could recall five units (I have a lot of Level 3s at this point), I had my three starters, and the two elves that join me. Every nightfall, I would get some of my units chipped away. Once I accepted that this was neccesary, I learned to sacrifice a unit to move the rest of my party forward.
6. 5 It gets pretty tedious, slowly moving your army forward.
7. Maybe some forests mixed in with the hills, so that you can actually set up some kind of tactical situation, instead of just having to sit there and get walloped.

pjr

Re: Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by pjr » October 11th, 2004, 3:04 am

(Comments based on 0.8.4)
Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Easy, medium.
Dave wrote:(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
3
Dave wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very clear.
Dave wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Very clear, but the dialogue is rather bald, doing nothing but communicate essential facts.
Dave wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None, once I'd worked out the basic concept of pushing ahead while guarding the rear.
Dave wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7. It becomes a lot more entertaining if you're strong enough to provoke ambushes deliberately.
Dave wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The NE orc is a pushover, and perhaps ought to be made a little stronger. However, some players seem to find this scenario very difficult, and I'm not unhappy with it as it is, so perhaps leaving it as it is would be better.

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Post by Zhukov » November 11th, 2005, 10:14 am

1) Difficulty played:
Medium only

2) Difficulty of level:
6/10 - same for killing one or both leaders. (If you kill the southern leader you have an opportunity to recruit/recall more units.)
This level was hard enough to make me accept the loss of a unit :!:
Poor archer :(

3) Objective clarity:
Crystal

4) Dialog:
I suppose it did the job. The ambush warnings were very cute. One thing: I don't really see the relevence of the whole level, but its not such a bad scenario so I guess that isn't important...

5) Challenges:
The ambushes were a pain, but I noticed that if your unit didn't actually end its move on the ambush hex it would pass safely. This meant my elven rider could happily grab villages that were nearly surrounded by ambush sites.
Because all enemies (except leaders) were lvl1, and thus of little XP value, I thought it was better to kill the east enemy early for a gold bonus, which comes in handy next scenario. On my first try I killed both leaders but came out with only ~300 gold, not really enough for the next level. However when I restarted and killed just the important leader I ended up with ~800 gold.

6) Fun:
5/10 - The level was a tad tedious at times, and the ambushes just got on my nerves.

7) This might seem tiny, but a pathway just one hex wider (or even two hexes wider :shock:) would help a lot.
Also maybe random ambushes? (Already been mentioned)

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Scenario Review: Crossroads

Post by Aloo » November 16th, 2005, 10:48 am

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?

Easy, Medium

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

7

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Intresting

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Not falling into too many ambushes while fighting regular units.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

7

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

a bit more space between hills and the road so its safer to go without fighting orcs on the hills

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