The South Guard

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aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

Sangel wrote:I've just started playing The South Guard, and I like it a lot. I can see why a lot of people want it to be included in the main Wesnoth files.
Thanks - that's high praise, and mostly undeserved - it's still a work in progress.
*In the very first scenario, "Born to the Banner" (nicely named) the early dialogue mentions "valorous" men. The correct adjective is "valiant".
http://www.bartleby.com/61/53/V0015300.html That said, I rather like the sound of valiant, so I will consider it. Valorous seems more archaic to me, which was intentional. Much of the language is an attempt at a conscious imitation of the dialect of Rohan from Tolkein.
*Why is it that Deoren moves only 6? This is highly unusual behaviour for a mounted unit, particularly a Level 2 one.
The only reason Deoran is level two is to allow his leadership to have some effect. I don't want him to be a super-hero unit. He's young (I'd say 22 or 23) and inexperienced.
*"Horseman Commander" and "Lancer Commander" sound somewhat ungainly, in my opinion. Some possible suggestions - "Border Captain" -> "Border Marshal"
The only reason that I'd hesitate at Border Captain and Marshall is that he's not really a border commander. He's a new commander detached on a special assignment. Any ideas?
*Deoren's graphics look like some of Shadow's earlier work - ie, indistinctly shaded, particularly the face. My current avatar is on offer if you want it, though I'd probably need to animate it and create a suitable level two version. I can modify it to suit better, if desired.
They are indeed generous donations by Shadow. They very closely approximate what I want Deoran to be, with the exception of the indistinct features, as you say. Your avatar, while outstanding, is much too big and scary for someone like Deoran. I want him to look a bit vulnerable. I'm honored by the offer, though.

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

Sangel
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Post by Sangel »

Here's a solution for both the naming problem and the leadership problem:

Give Deoren 3 levels, as most heroes have:
Novice Captain (or Young Captain, or somesuch)
Border Captain
Border Marshal

On Civilian and Recruit difficulty levels, have him start as level two. On Soldier difficulty, have him start as level one. Give the Border Captain and Novice Captain 7 movement, and remove the Novice Captain's lance - just a Mace for young Deoren.

Have a (slightly) different introduction for the different difficulty levels. In one, "Deoren, having proven himself many times on the jousting fields and sparring rings, was dispatched to test his skills in true command" -> Deoren is level two.

In the other, "Deoren, young for his post but eager to live up to his father's glory, was dispatched to discover the reason for Sir Loric's silence."

Of course, this is all just a suggestion. Fiddle with it as you will. And while I'm mostly working on graphics for Quartex's (also superb) Under the Burning Suns, I might take a quick look at possible graphics for multiple levels of Deoren.

---------

A couple more suggestions, as I've moved farther along in the campaign:

"A Choice in the Fog" needs more dialogue, particularly when you face Mal M'drin. There should be some sort of dialogue when you first spot him:
Soldier: "Err - is that Medrin?"
Ethiliel: "Alas, I fear it is. We must defeat him!"

And when you engage him in combat:
Soldier: "He vanished!"
Ethiliel: "He has probably retreated into the catacombs... <moves on into the rest of the end dialogue".

Additionally, I think that if you choose to attack Urza Alfalas rather than ally with him, he ought to have a death line:
Urza Alfalas: "You short-sighted fools... that damned lich will destroy you all..."
"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

I've made some of the changes you suggested, and fiddled a bit with the dialog and names of the first four scenarios.

I now am happy with the ending I've written for the elven branch (the WML for the last scenario is tricky, though - working on it now).

I'm just concerned that "Into the Depths" is too big to be fun. I'd like to keep it as a giant exploration level, so here's my WML question of the day: does anyone know how to change the movement value of a terrain for just one scenario? I'd like to make the caves take only as much movement as dirt road. That way the map can be big, but doable. As it stands, I think you spend too much time moving and not enough exploring or fighting.

I've got a pretty major update that I'm waiting to upload until the next version comes out (with the [Objective] tag). If that's more than a week away, I'll upload one now without it. Anybody have any idea how close we are?

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

Sangel
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Post by Sangel »

Well, there's a string freeze starting Monday, and that usually precedes a release by one week or so, correct?
"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

There's a new version up on the campaign server: 0.7.0 Here's a quick list of the changes:

* It is now possible to play both branches through to their conclusion.
* "Vengeance", the last scenario of the elven branch, is still very much in progress, and, as it stands, somewhat anticlimactic.
* Both branches now have epilogues, that hopefully tie things together nicely. (And leave room for a sequel!)
* Numerous dialog and bug fixes. General spit and polish.
- Nasty bug at the end of Finding the Elves fixed. No more level 3 elves!
- "[event]name=sighted" bug fixed in Proven by the Sword
- Horseman and Lancer Commander tweaked. Still looking for better names.

* I've renamed a couple of the scenarios to things I think work better. Still pondering some. The only one's I'm really happy with are :
- Born to the Banner
- Proven by the Sword
- Pebbles in the Flood
- The Tides of War

Some Ideas:
- "The Messenger" to "Tidings, Good and Ill"
- "The Long March" to "The Prey, Once Hunted"

Any thoughts? Inspirations?

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

quartex
Inactive Developer
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Location: Boston, MA

Post by quartex »

Scenario titles can be a pain. I've spent a lot of time pondering different titles for my scenarios. "A choice in the fog" seemed like a nice simple title fopr a scenario that offers you two choices and a fork in the campaign. I like "Tidings, good and ill", but I think that "The Long March" is better than "prey, once hunted", gramatically the latter doesn't quite work.

Keep up the good work.

aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

quartex wrote: I think that "The Long March" is better than "prey, once hunted", gramatically the latter doesn't quite work.
I'm not really happy with either. I'd like to capture the idea that the bandit you were chasing is now your only hope of safety.

"Blind Leading the Blind" isn't quite right (not to mention terribly cliché).
"Roles Reversed", while alliterative, is too obvious by half.

It really is hard naming scenarios well.

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

quartex
Inactive Developer
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Location: Boston, MA

Post by quartex »

The world of wesnoth and the plots to many of our campaigns are all about fantasy clichés. So I think sometimes clichés can be funny. But I suppose we should think of better titles. I'm thinking of calling my next scenario "Out of the Frying Pan..." if I can't think of anything better.

claus
Posts: 186
Joined: April 4th, 2005, 5:51 am

Post by claus »

I think something is wrong with your uploaded version of the campaign (0.7.0). First i had the old version installed and installed the new version over it. This way i had problems with loading my save games. (illegal end tag [/event] at the end of a message in the file Born_To_The_Banner. I tried loading one of the later elf saves and choice_in_the_fog!!)
Then i deleted the campaign and tried to install the new version (0.7.0). Now i got a message that the game configuration files are corrupted and the same illegal end tag. The upload exited with a network communication error.

aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

Yep - there's a type in Born to the Banner that prevents you from playing on the easiest difficulty. I'll upload a fix sometime later today. Thanks!

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

telex4
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Joined: December 14th, 2003, 1:24 am
Location: Reading, UK
Contact:

Post by telex4 »

aelius wrote:Yep - there's a type in Born to the Banner that prevents you from playing on the easiest difficulty. I'll upload a fix sometime later today. Thanks!
I get an error in the first scenario when I land a unit on the village that triggers the appearance of the Mermen. I'm using a CVS checkout, so maybe that's the problem, or it could be the space in between the apostrophe and the M in "Merman"...
The game could not be loaded: load game failed: Unit not found: ' Merman Fighter'
edit: I had a quick look and spotted the silly error. Look at line 254, and you'll notice a space in between "type=" and the unit type. The same applies for all three declarations, both times they're made in the file. Removing the space solved the problem.

aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

I've uploaded a version that should fix all of those outstanding bugs and add some 0.9.0 specific features (go dynamic objectives!)

I've also cleaned up the dialogue in the first act, and reworked some of the minor events.

The third act is still pretty rough (especially the last scenario in both branches), but I'll keep plugging on.

Also, I've gone back to my inexpertly drawn Horseman Commander, which I feel better fits the theme of Wesnoth, and the character of Deroan. Anybody want to take a shot at making an even less impressive version of him to be the Junior Commander?

School's busy, so it may be a while before another update, unless there are campaign breaking bugs...

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

tkilian
Posts: 62
Joined: May 4th, 2004, 6:46 pm

Problem

Post by tkilian »

I am using the latest version 9.1, and downloaded the latest version fo the campaign off of the server 8.1

When I get to "A desperate Errand", it won't load.

load_game_failed map not found.

aelius
Posts: 497
Joined: August 30th, 2004, 8:07 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Post by aelius »

I've uploaded another version. Unfortuntaely, you can't see the version number in the new campaign server displays, but if you can download it again, let me know if it works better now.

You may have to play Proven by the Sword over again to force the game to load the new files.

- b.
La perfection est atteinte non quand il ne reste rien à ajouter, mais quand il ne reste rien à enlever. - Antoine de Saint Exupery (of course)

Jyhem
Posts: 80
Joined: March 20th, 2004, 4:53 pm
Location: Strasbourg

Post by Jyhem »

I like this campaign.

Minor details:
the level 3 Deoran lacks a "leadership" sprite, it seems.
He just vanishes when the "leadership" is supposed
to kick in.
I fails to see how vanishing in the midst of battle could
raise his mens' morale :-D

Also, in "A Desparate Errand" -> "A Desperate Errand"
"Move Deoran to the Evlish city" -> "Move Deoran to the Elvish city"

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