[Historical] Legend of Wesmere (add-on version)

mpolo · Post by **mpolo** » January 7th, 2005, 9:22 pm

Story problem... In The Rise of Wesnoth, Haldric now dumps the Ruby of Fire down in the cave (where it is presumably rediscoved as the Scepter of Fire by Konrad/Li'sar), rather than using it and letting it drive him mad as your plot indicates... Maybe a little tweaking is in order.

Shade · Post by **Shade** » January 7th, 2005, 9:32 pm

mpolo wrote:Story problem... In The Rise of Wesnoth, Haldric now dumps the Ruby of Fire down in the cave (where it is presumably rediscoved as the Scepter of Fire by Konrad/Li'sar), rather than using it and letting it drive him mad as your plot indicates... Maybe a little tweaking is in order.

In TRoW it is never clearly stated that the Ruby of Fire becomes the Scepter of Fire. Even if it is the same Ruby it would have had to gone on some adventures to grow a scepter

There is room for a story in there someplace ...

edit #2: Another neat fact- If you read the text in TRoW. Haldric asks Jessica if she did as he asked, she NEVER clearly answers...

Disto · Post by **Disto** » January 7th, 2005, 9:35 pm

Is this Wesmere?

Post by **santi** » January 8th, 2005, 6:12 am

Wow, I found some bugs in the WML I'm fixing now so I'm surprised people got as far as Revelations-anyway I assume you read the cfg files.

Now answers:
1)
Mpolo, the story of the sceptre is not as you say. Indeed in HttT the king assigns the dwarvish craftsmen the task of making a sceptre
out of the ruby. This is in line with Shade/Haldric's "somebody ought to attach a string to it or something" in A last Spring when he is experimenting with it. In fact when the orc sinvade Knalga and the sceptre is lost, the king sends the 'lost general' Lionel to retrieve it, so it is definitely not lost or simply dumped in a troll hole by that time. In the present campaign when (much later) Delf meets Kalenz, there will be a dialog to the effect that elves do not trust human kings because of the darn ruby and its effects as mentioned by Crelanu, so Delf advises the king to shield it, hence the decision to make it into a sceptre.

As Shade mentions, TROW is very noncommital and leaves much room for
stories to grow. This campaign is not as noncommital(regettably)
and there are explanations which explain some things and on the other hand unfortunately put some constraints on alternative scenaria.

Note on the other hand that this story is WHAT CRELANU says, not necesarily true... In the present camapaign we do not ever find out
if things are as Crelanu says ....
Which allows for an interesing new campaign, like 'Crelanu's story'

2)Disto
Is what Wesmere? Wesmere is the central forest where the majority of (not-North) Elves live. Not my choice as name, read the Wesnoth history.

Post by **santi** » January 8th, 2005, 6:15 am

Disto: If you mean in the campaign server, the asnwer is yes. LOW has been renamed Legend_of_Wesmere and is now on the server. I'm now fixing the 6 more bugs left before updating to 0.5.2

Post by **santi** » January 8th, 2005, 10:49 am

Even found the actual post from the Ruby creator himself, Shade!

Posted: Thu Jul 15, 2004 11:39 pm Post subject: Actually. . .

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

.....

The Ruby is integrated into this story (it is implied that the ruby goes on to be the big red thing at the end of the 'Sceptre of Fire', 'Ouch, hot, somebody should really attach this thing to a sceptre". It has been specified the the sceptre was crafted by the dwarves, but there was no mention of where that Ruby came from)

It all comes together (I just don't want to give a bunch of spoilers).

l'ultimo cruco · Post by **l'ultimo cruco** » January 8th, 2005, 1:23 pm

santi wrote:Version 5.1 is on the server(still incomplete). Not sure how balanced the last scenarios are though.

Ok, here I'm back again (remember? I couldn't se the signpost...)
Very nice campaign; I liked the big battle for Kalian.
some feed back (version 0.4 on BfW0.8.8 on MAcOS 10.3.6)

saurian_treasury
the victory conditions are not completely clear; maybe you should make a pop up with the changed vicotory conditions once the "treasure guards" appear; rather challenging map, good

Elves'_last_stand
1. I would have preferred if the other elfish parties would have taken a more defensive approach, or in other words: retreat and survive.
But hey, they bought me some precious time to get rid of the trolls.
2. Olurf arrives to late to be of a great use. In the start its not clear if he arrives at all or if its a bug...

I'd prefer Olurf with less powerful troops but from the start or an earlier apperance with some notice(read: put it in the initial dialog "olurf will get here by night fall/morning/whatever", so you can decide to rely on him to get rid of the trolls or not... - you might even be nasty enough to announce his arrival for a certain turn and then delay it, you know these are unsafe times...
3. and at the end a big question: I managed to kill all leaders by turn 22 or so. After the victory message with the bonuses I ended up with some 1300 gold ->80% 1011 gold
this is conserved intact through the council_of_hard_decisions, but as soon as bounty_hunters starts this transforms into 211 gold ???
Tried once more waiting until turn 24 to kill the last leader ending up with 998 gold remaining for the next scenario. As soon as b_h started they transformed to 198 gold!!!
Is this intentional or just a bug?
I tried to load the savefile in tje latest/0.5.1 version but the results are the same loding the end of e_l_s or the beginning of b-h

Keep it up. I like this campaign.

Post by **santi** » January 8th, 2005, 9:43 pm

L'ultimo Cruco wrote:

Ok, here I'm back again (remember? I couldn't se the signpost...)

Sure, I always remember a Kalenz-fan (and one of the first for that matter)

Very nice campaign; I liked the big battle for Kalian.

Thanks, very nice to hear. (you mean the first battle or Elves Last stand?)
I had some negative feedback by people fearing this might be too long and boring
some feed back (version 0.4 on BfW0.8.8 on MAcOS 10.3.6)

saurian_treasury
the victory conditions are not completely clear; maybe you should make a pop up with the changed vicotory conditions once the "treasure guards" appear; rather challenging map, good

Yes, this is being changed. I think I will put something to the effect: exit the treasury with the gold

Elves'_last_stand
1. I would have preferred if the other elfish parties would have taken a more defensive approach, or in other words: retreat and survive.
But hey, they bought me some precious time to get rid of the trolls.

The best solution is to give the player control over all elvish units. Not sure if this is
desirable though, the challenge is to give them proper support to save
Galtrid and avoid the collapse of the front while you finish off the trolls, for instance
though there may be different strategies here.

2. Olurf arrives to late to be of a great use. In the start its not clear if he arrives at all or if its a bug...
I'd prefer Olurf with less powerful troops but from the start or an earlier apperance with
some notice(read: put it in the initial dialog "olurf will get here by night fall/morning/whatever", so you can decide to rely on him to get rid of the trolls or not... - you might even be nasty enough to announce his arrival for a certain turn and then delay it, you know these are unsafe times...

I think you will find the latest versions harder than version 4.0. In some cases Olurf arrives just on time, as the northern front hangs by a hair. But basically the idea is that the dwarves
do not actualy help in ELves last stand, but they do arrive and are useful for the trip to Thoria. I plan to ask for what users prefer in this respect. DO I have a vote for Olurf arriving earlier?(but please consider that the current ELS is harder and you actually have a choice of fighting many many but less intelligent enemies or a little less but smarter enemies)

3. and at the end a big question: I managed to kill all leaders by turn 22 or so. After the victory message with the bonuses I ended up with some 1300 gold ->80% 1011 gold
this is conserved intact through the council_of_hard_decisions, but as soon as bounty_hunters starts this transforms into 211 gold ???
Tried once more waiting until turn 24 to kill the last leader ending up with 998 gold remaining for the next scenario. As soon as b_h started they transformed to 198 gold!!!
Is this intentional or just a bug?

This is the idea, but there was also a bug, namely it depended on how muchmore than 800 gold you had, so 198=998-800. The point at the end of the council is that you have lots of gold, but since Kalenz goes on the road trip to Thoria he has to leave lots of gold
and troops behind to guard Wesmere, so it is understandbale that you will not have all that gold. It has been changed in the latest version(and please wait for version 5.2 to go on the server in a couple of days) and you have some 287 gold after council.

I tried to load the savefile in tje latest/0.5.1 version but the results are the same loding the end of e_l_s or the beginning of b-h

If you want to play say ELS with the new version you need to load the save file of the previous scenario, Aquaintance in Need

Keep it up. I like this campaign.

Thanks a lot! So more incentive to try to make it so you will continue to like it.

Post by **santi** » January 9th, 2005, 11:52 am

Version 0.5.2 is on the campaign server. No really new scenaria except Ancient Alliance which will be perhaps changed,(since this may be in another human campaign, so elves+dwarves should probably just fight+cut off orcish reinforcements in that battle)
but a lot of bug fixes(I think right now up till Ancient Alliance the campaign
is fairly bug-free, I know these are words I'll probably regret)

except for Landar appearing both as himself and an elvish archer when he returns in News_from_the_front

Anyway, hope this is fun!
Please let me know if this seems too easy or too hard. I fear the entire Thoria campaign might be too easy for experienced players.

Disto · Post by **Disto** » January 9th, 2005, 1:05 pm

Do you want me to make you a new Elvish Elder because no offence but the existing one needs a hell of a lot of work.

l'ultimo cruco · Post by **l'ultimo cruco** » January 9th, 2005, 4:29 pm

santi wrote:Version 0.5.2 is on the campaign server.
...
Anyway, hope this is fun!
Please let me know if this seems too easy or too hard. I fear the entire Thoria campaign might be too easy for experienced players.

on version 0.5.1
I went on until crelanus book without great difficulties;
actually had to replay bounty hunters as I choose the wrong strategy the first time. The second time I left a few good troops behind in favourable terrain, which then lured the AI to send in more and more units soon to get killed. In the meantime Kalenz made a run just with cleo.. the shyde.

In cliffs of thoria, you might consider to move the griffon camp to the upper left corner in order to get the player forced to pass between the two forces. The time I reached the griffon camp the leader had been already killed by the trolls so it was a cake walk, as the trolls get fried by the sorcerers and what remaind pierced by the avengers..

battle of the book was a tough fight for a couple of turns than - taking loads of damages - the drake front caved in... I finished it in 7 turns.
Try a second, minor drake camp in the upper right corner forcing the player to split troops. Maybe as well some good, allied defensive units (ex: "stone trolls" with a single medium attack but good defense and tons of hp, to use as leaving shields for the drakes...). After all the leader is a mage, he might get some nice allies; maybe right in the drake campaign there was such a type of unit - I remember reading it on the forum somewhere; you might ask MadMax...

Maybe you should force Kalenz to leave his "free troops"(the shyde+...from the elven treasury, + Andulias) at Kalian after ELS to guard the city and prepare the defences, leaving just with Olurf and Landar. Starting out with 6 level 3 units for free makes life a lot easier, maybe to easy...

I'll be back once I checked out the latest version further.
Don't worry it's fun.

Post by **santi** » January 9th, 2005, 4:45 pm

Disto: Thanks for your offer! The Elvish Elder image has been lifted from Matt's campaign
and I agree it's not good. So I'll gladly and thankfully take your offer!

L'ultimoc cruco:
Thanks for your suggestions: They make lot of sense. This is my feeling too, Bounty hunters, CLiffs and Battle of the book being currently too easy. Your suggestions are very good.
Cleodil is needed, not only to slow the yetis, but also to take over Crelanu's book. Andulias could stay behind, maybe other troops too(though this is perhaps Kalenz's most loyal friend)
I think due to a bug in 5.1 you do not get to fight the sea creatures when you cross ...
This has been fixed in 5.2 and you probably need more units than just Kalenz to cross. Huraldur the scout is especially useful there...

Anyway, thanks again!

Post by **santi** » January 10th, 2005, 1:02 pm

How does this look for an 'invisible Elvish Avenger', i.e. Landar after drinking the potion? gimp->select by color->Toggle Quick Mask

Any better ideas? Disto?

Porcupine · Post by **Porcupine** » March 3rd, 2005, 8:12 pm

Hi, I just download the latest verson but it doesen't seem to work with 8.11. I started out with my saved game and it gives the screano not found message. Same thing when I start out in the beggining.

Porcupine

Post by **santi** » March 4th, 2005, 10:45 am

Thanks, I will look into that, though it works fine under 8.11 for me
but I am using the new version, not yet on the campaign server(trying to get some more scenaria in, don't know though if phase 1 of the campaign will be complete by Sunday).
Anyway, on Sunday I should release the new version. Meanwhile
can you please let me know what system you are using?

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[Historical] Legend of Wesmere (add-on version)

Invisible units: Any better ideas?