Liberty

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torangan
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Post by torangan » November 8th, 2007, 1:20 am

Stedevil wrote:Indeed, and I'd be interested in trying it out. How do I do to try this out before 1.3.10. I compile from source right now so what would be the easiest way to do it? Get SVN or manually edit my version and recompile?
Get SVN or wait a few days, a source tarball for 1.3.10 will be available very soon unless some heavy bugs appear.
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zookeeper
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Post by zookeeper » November 8th, 2007, 7:34 am

Stedevil wrote:
zookeeper wrote:I changed the turn limit of A Strategy of Hope from 44,42,40 to 35,30,25. That should eliminate some of the excess gold.
I guess that works out well for a quick fix. However the real problem I assume is the lack of gold for the Saurian AI player. There is just no way to win in 15ish turns if you are actually attacked from both sides.

Right now you can literally send only 2 single units to take out the Saurian commander (he only fields like 4-5 units in total and they move to attack your AI friend). This allows you to send almost ALL your forces SE towards the Orks, hold them back and (as ork AI money runs out) push through and finish the leader.

If you actually where attacked properly by the Saurians (eg 20-25 units, instead of 4-5) finishing in 25 turns might actually be a very very hard target to reach.
The saurian problem isn't luckily such a big problem because your ally will take care of them, after all (you might still want to send a unit or two that way to ensure you'll get the leader).

Anyways, I'll check what's going on with the saurians in a while and whether they actually need more gold.
Stedevil wrote:
EDIT: Ok, I've now made the beginning peasants (except for Baldras and Harper, of course) non-loyal, and have the scenario an early finishing bonus as well.
Did you give ownership of all the villages to the player as well? If not then one will haemorrhage gold quite bad in the beginning. OTOH, you get all your units for free and in worst case you have just minimum gold for next scenario (which realistically is not very much less then in a best case result). So everything considered it might work just fine.
Nope. I tested it, and you start the scenario with only -2 income, so by grabbing one village you're already even, and due to the early finish bonus you can actually get some extra for the next scenario.

EDIT: Yep, I played through the scenario on normal difficulty, finished on turn 9 with 134 gold and with the bonus entered the second one with exactly 200 gold.
Stedevil wrote:Also, did you consider moving the start placement of the wolves a bit further away in the first scenario or is it deliberate that 2-3 are easily fooled into attacking you?
I did, but didn't do anything about it yet. It's not too bad IMO that you can lure a few of them into hitting range of your village elders and their maces: dealing with even just two pillagers with only footpads and a poacher or two (I usually send a force like that north to catch the leader) seems to be quite enough of a little contest.
Stedevil wrote:Indeed, and I'd be interested in trying it out. How do I do to try this out before 1.3.10. I compile from source right now so what would be the easiest way to do it? Get SVN or manually edit my version and recompile?
Or you can use 1.3.9 and just grab the latest .cfg's from SVN, as they should be very compatible (maps won't be, but I only did one very minor map update which you don't need). The web interface would be found here.

Stedevil
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Post by Stedevil » November 8th, 2007, 11:40 am

zookeeper wrote:The saurian problem isn't luckily such a big problem because your ally will take care of them, after all (you might still want to send a unit or two that way to ensure you'll get the leader).
Well yes, it really depends on what the intention with the scenario is. If your ally is supposed to keep back the Saurians and you are supposed to take on the orks + 2 guys to trap and kill the Saurian leader then eg 25 turns is the right solution. I just assumed, due to the 40 turn limit, lots of villages and potential 2 front war, that the Saurians as well was supposed to mount a real assault forcing you to split up your forces and making it a slow attrition battle.
Anyways, I'll check what's going on with the saurians in a while and whether they actually need more gold.
They dont seem to have enough start gold to even fill up their 4 available castle areas. Usually they recruit 3 + 1 in turn 1 & 2 respectively. But as said before, if this is right or wrong depends on the intention of the scenario.
Nope. I tested it, and you start the scenario with only -2 income, so by grabbing one village you're already even, and due to the early finish bonus you can actually get some extra for the next scenario.
Ahh yepp, the finishing bonus of course makes a big difference since you dont need to pay upkeep for your units and of course 2 units are not on the field at start.


PS Thanks to both of you for the suggestions of how to try these changes out :)

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Post by Stedevil » November 11th, 2007, 8:37 am

Ok, did the overwrite config thing and tried it out.

Mission 1-3 feels much much better now. 1st have appropriate difficulty and money and the third has become a lot less lame with the Saurian (in 5 tries) purchasing 7-9 units at start and putting up a good fight. In the end I caught the Saurian leader by turn 12 (which required both luck and 4 units instead of a measly 2) and won by turn 17 but still didnt retain more then 388gold for next mission. A lot better then the previous easy 1k gold! :)

Good work :)

SigntheWord
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Post by SigntheWord » November 18th, 2007, 3:46 pm

Putting gameplay issues aside, I thought the storyline was excellently executed. The dialogue was moralizing and well-written which really bought you into the mood the of the game; the background music in the Human/Undead and the final scenario were very fulfilled in their situations. It was great playing the campaign.

Ar-Senator
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Post by Ar-Senator » November 25th, 2007, 11:10 am

Hmm, should I be able to level my units into third level? The peasant-named units have 3rd level advancements on their profile, but after they're turned to outlaws and the like they only get AMLAs. There's the fugitives that the shadow mages recruit but I can't get them.

tpac
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Post by tpac » December 20th, 2007, 4:13 am

HI. I've just played through Liberty in 1.3.12 and enjoyed it quite a bit. I played on Intermediate. I'll try it on hard, on Intermediate it seemed a bit too easy - for the most part your opponents don't seem to raise any army after the initial batch and your allies are very strong. Perhaps add a few more villages in the opponents corners, and take some off the allies.

1. The Raid - Finished on turn 6 out of 18. Seemed about right.
2. Civil Disobedience. 10/13. Good, maybe a few more villages in enemy control.
3. Strategy of Hope. 18/36. Solid
4. Unlawful Orders - 10/26. Night/day undead/loyalist switch was cool. A tad easy - maybe a little more cash for Kestrel and less for Maddock.
5. Hide and Seek - 18/28. This was pretty cool.
6. Gray Woods - 20/44. Opponents are fine but ally (Helicrom) seems way too strong. Out of curiosity, I replayed again by not doing anything - just sitting there hitting end turn - and he finished the entire thing with no assistance by turn 36.
7. The Hunters - 14/31. Maybe a second incursion.
8. Glory - 29/45. This one was challenging, I had to go back several turns and try a different approach more than one. Though I went for complete annihilation and not just the trapdoors. I enjoyed the combo of the guards staying in the castle and the influx of reinforcements - I would try attack and night, retreat to heal during the day and the inside troops wouldn't follow me for the kill, but the reinforcements I'd have to deal with. The orc leader seemed the first enemy leader to actually have enough income to keep hiring troops.

I was actually disappointed it ended since I wanted to keep playing more of the campaign - best recommendation I can think of ;)

dthurston
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Team colors in last scenario

Post by dthurston » December 26th, 2007, 3:56 am

In Glory (1.3.12), both the loyalists and the orcs ended up with a blue team color. Looking at the WML, I see that the orcs are given a color explicitly, and the loyalists happened to be the same color. I don't know where this should be fixed.

rand
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Post by rand » January 1st, 2008, 5:07 pm

Possible bug report.... I've just made it to the third scenario (A Strategy of Hope), but am getting a "The file you have tried to load is corrupt" error during the intro sequence, right after the second unit (a trapper in this case) is recruited. This is on 1.3.13.

Weeksy
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Post by Weeksy » January 1st, 2008, 8:51 pm

I'm assuming you're using a save from 1.3.12 or older. You should either restart the campaign or finish it in your old version of wesnoth.

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Mist
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Post by Mist » January 1st, 2008, 9:08 pm

Actualy it's a known bug, result of one of the new 1.3.13 features. There are few ugly hacks that could sort the problem for now but the clean fix will be incorporated in the next relase.
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tr0ll
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Re: Outlaw campaign: Liberty

Post by tr0ll » August 22nd, 2009, 12:24 am

This is a great campaign. I played it through in version 1.2 / 1.3 and wanted to try again with the recent improvements.

When i play Hide and Seek scenario with version 1.7.3 it sure seems like the AI is cheating, because they converge on me even if i stay out of their range. i havent tried the path suggested in the walkthrough yet because i havent gotten an opportunity to leave the edge of the map.

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StandYourGround
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Re: Outlaw campaign: Liberty

Post by StandYourGround » August 22nd, 2009, 2:35 am

1.7 messed up something with the AI for that, so they don't behave as statue-like sentries that only move if they can "see" you. The same problem also affects the scenario "The Chief Must Die" in Legend of Wesmere. Until this problem is fixed, your best bet is to move your outlaws through rocky hill and forest terrain along the right side of the screen, because it slows down the loyalists more than you, and you get better defense. Stick to the right edge, and try to time your arrival at the right edge of town just right so you can rush across the smallest amount of open terrain as fast as possible. Avoid stopping in villages, since that raises the alarm. Rather, kill everyone who is attacking you, and wait some turns to get a little healing if necessary. Also, the sooner you kill the sentries attacking you, the better, since the rest that are converging on you from unseen areas will stop pursuing you until someone "sees" you again.
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Crab
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Re: Outlaw campaign: Liberty

Post by Crab » August 28th, 2009, 10:45 pm

1.7 messed up something with the AI for that, so they don't behave as statue-like sentries that only move if they can "see" you. The same problem also affects the scenario "The Chief Must Die" in Legend of Wesmere.
Fixed in trunk, fix will be available in 1.7.4. For existing games, fix will require loading from start-of-scenario save. (It's also possible to fix by fixing the mid-level savegame by hand)

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tr0ll
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Re: Outlaw campaign: Liberty

Post by tr0ll » October 25th, 2009, 3:44 am

thanks it played just fine in 1.7.6!

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