The Gods

gimderel · Post by **gimderel** » July 15th, 2009, 9:07 pm

Do the races of wesnoth have any deities? I would imagine that there are at least five; on for the men, one for the elves (possibly a goddess),
one for the Dwarves, one for the orcs, and a major evil God. are there minor deities, or elemental deities?

Hatter_Madigan · Post by **Hatter_Madigan** » July 15th, 2009, 9:19 pm

I thought for sure that there was strictly no religion in Wesnoth???

Post by **thespaceinvader** » July 15th, 2009, 9:47 pm

No. No Religion In Wesnoth is a rule in Wesnoth, instituted very early to avoid the possibility of giving offence by including such entities. There are, therefore, no gods mentioned in mainline.

Aethaeryn (User Page) · Post by **Aethaeryn** » July 15th, 2009, 9:53 pm

Please use the search function for "religion" or "god" - there are probably dozens of threads on this issue.

gimderel wrote:I would imagine that there are at least five; on for the men, one for the elves (possibly a goddess), one for the Dwarves, one for the orcs, and a major evil God.

This is assuming five separate monotheistic systems. You also left out Drakes, and the lesser (not central focus of a multiplayer faction) races, and they might have no "gods" (maybe they just believe in many spirits, or maybe they're atheistic). What's for certain is that there's no official, canon religions/gods in Wesnoth and it's pointless to discuss hypothetical religions if they're not going to be official.

thespaceinvader wrote:No. No Religion In Wesnoth is a rule in Wesnoth, instituted very early to avoid the possibility of giving offence by including such entities. There are, therefore, no gods mentioned in mainline.

Yes, it was adapted very early, but it has been relaxed slightly in recent threads. I'd speak more on it but I was quite confused by more recent discussions myself.

Thanatos · Post by **Thanatos** » July 15th, 2009, 10:08 pm

Gimderel, please check out this recent topic, which you probably could have found yourself, if you'd used the search button: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=25928
You'll may be interested in the links, Turuk and I gave there.

I see this topic locked very soon by someone with an orange nick.

Aethaeryn (User Page) · Post by **Aethaeryn** » July 15th, 2009, 10:16 pm

The link above doesn't really state what the policy is, it just says that NRIW is not policy anymore.

After some quick searching, I think I've found the latest specific ruling from a developer.

Boucman wrote:We have been discussing, and the official position is that we don't want to have any official policy, unless it's absolutely needed.

If that were to happen, that would be discussed between devs on the mailing list between devs.

This makes this thread pointless.

Thanatos · Post by **Thanatos** » July 15th, 2009, 10:22 pm

Aethaeryn wrote:
Boucman wrote:We have been discussing, and the official position is that we don't want to have any official policy, unless it's absolutely needed.

If that were to happen, that would be discussed between devs on the mailing list between devs.
This makes this thread pointless.

Why this? Your quoted message is the final post in this very thread!
And official policy or none... the effect is obvious.

Aethaeryn (User Page) · Post by **Aethaeryn** » July 15th, 2009, 10:24 pm

Thanatos wrote:Why this? Your quoted message is the final post in this very thread!
And official policy or none... the effect is obvious.

It's the final post in the thread linked to at the end of the thread you linked to. Two lines is significantly shorter/clearer than three pages of reading to arrive to those two lines.

Thanatos · Post by **Thanatos** » July 15th, 2009, 10:28 pm

Aethaeryn wrote:
Thanatos wrote:Why this? Your quoted message is the final post in this very thread!
And official policy or none... the effect is obvious.
It's the final post in the thread linked to in the end of the thread you linked to. Two lines is significantly shorter/clearer than three pages of reading to arrive to those two lines.

You are right for the type of person who accepts decisions without even asking for the reasons. I expected that the discussion might help understanding the rule. I think we are just different types in this area.

Aethaeryn (User Page) · Post by **Aethaeryn** » July 15th, 2009, 10:30 pm

Thanatos wrote:
Aethaeryn wrote: It's the final post in the thread linked to in the end of the thread you linked to. Two lines is significantly shorter/clearer than three pages of reading to arrive to those two lines.
You are right for the type of person who accepts decisions without even asking for the reasons. I expected that the discussion might help understanding the rule. I think we are just different types in this area.

Unfortunately, I think only Boucman's one post counts as "official" reasoning with the rest being speculation/discussion/debate as to the Will of the Developers.

AzuSkyLigh · Post by **AzuSkyLigh** » July 15th, 2009, 10:32 pm

Would it hurt to have a religion among the humans(or whomever else) that focuses on an abstract and omnipresent influence in the world, such as the Force in the Star Wars universe and the Light in the Warcraft universe?

Taken from wowwiki:

The followers of the Holy Light do not worship any gods. Instead, it is a philosophy, training its followers to seek perfection within themselves. It is very much an active practice of virtue rather than a passive worship. Those who follow it closely gain spiritual awareness and guidance, allowing them to lead others.

The Holy Light teaches that there is a connection between the self and the universe. This connection manifests as what we feel through both senses and emotions. When a person is moved, through seeing something breathtaking or feeling love for another, that emotion connects him to the universe. Experiencing the emotion ensures that he exists, as something within him felt the emotions or processed the sensual awareness. Because he exists, so must the universe that gave him that feeling. From there, he can act upon the universe, causing more changes to create feeling in others. Thus, the followers of Holy Light seek to make the world a better place by being true to their own emotions.

The next step in recognizing this connection between the self and the universe is developing the goodness within and without. If one wishes for happiness, one must work to better the universe to make others happy. Experiencing the glory and beauty of the world will in turn tap into the inner beauty and glory within one's soul. However, giving in to greed, despair, and unhappiness will only darken the universe. The Holy Light is the glory of the universe reflected upon the soul and mirrored back onto itself.

Holy Light practitioners consist mainly of humans and draenei. There were once many high elves and dwarves practicing the philosophy, but their numbers have dwindled in recent years. As high elves traveled further into the darkness of their arcane magic addiction, they fell from the Holy Light. The dwarves have replaced the Light with the study of their progenitors, the titans. The night elves are too new to the Alliance and too entrenched in their own worship of Elune and the other Ancients to consider the Holy Light in large numbers, and it is unheard of to think of Horde races following the philosophy with the notable except of a few Trolls such as Zabra Hexx.

Members of the Church of Light follow a philosophy called the three virtues.

It seems pretty sensible, especially concerning the Magi of Light in the Loyalist faction.

Aethaeryn (User Page) · Post by **Aethaeryn** » July 15th, 2009, 10:42 pm

AzuSkyLigh wrote:Would it hurt to have a religion among the humans(or whomever else) that focuses on an abstract and omnipresent influence in the world, such as the Force in the Star Wars universe and the Light in the Warcraft universe?

Yes. Just because NRIW isn't strictly enforced anymore doesn't mean the developers are going to openly develop and add a religion, either, no matter how un-religious that religion seems.

The1exile · Post by **The1exile** » July 15th, 2009, 11:41 pm

AzuSkyLigh wrote:Would it hurt to have a religion among the humans(or whomever else) that focuses on an abstract and omnipresent influence in the world, such as the Force in the Star Wars universe and the Light in the Warcraft universe?

Hey, if it's UMC, knock yourself out. NRIW only applies to mainline and writing relating to it.

TheGreatRings · Post by **TheGreatRings** » July 16th, 2009, 1:30 am

I'm not sure I would be entirely happy with actual Gods confirmed to exist in Wesnoth. I have no problem with the Wesnoth civilizations having religions (I'd say it adds realism, which to me is about the most important thing as a writer), but I'm not sure how I would feel about "canonizing" a single religion as the right one, for example.

I don't care that much though. But I've always thought the outright "no religion in Wesnoth" policy was kind of pointless.

Post by **Turuk** » July 16th, 2009, 1:51 am

I regret that work kept me from nipping this in the bud sooner.

Aethaeryn wrote:Yes, it was adapted very early, but it has been relaxed slightly in recent threads. I'd speak more on it but I was quite confused by more recent discussions myself.

There was no relaxing of any rule, and if you do not understand the previous discussions, then why did you keep commenting?

Also, there is a notable difference between having no official policy unless necessary, and "relaxing" what was believed to be a rule.

The OP had his question answered, and this thread is now only going in circles. Locked.

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