Campaign recall lists

[fredbobsmith2]

I am playing Rise of Wesnoth right now, and at some point I got stuck and went to the wiki walkthrough for help. However, I found that the pointers at the beginning of the walkthrough were most helpful, in advising me in what types of units I would want to promote. This was great, since if I just feed kills to whoever gets them, I usually end up with loads of the same unit or units, and almost none of everything else. So I thought it might be helpful for newer players (ie, myself) if the forum had a thread that could combine the collective opinions on what might be good levelled units in various campaigns.

[HomerJ]

I am playing Rise of Wesnoth right now, and at some point I got stuck and went to the wiki walkthrough for help. However, I found that the pointers at the beginning of the walkthrough were most helpful, in advising me in what types of units I would want to promote. This was great, since if I just feed kills to whoever gets them, I usually end up with loads of the same unit or units, and almost none of everything else. So I thought it might be helpful for newer players (ie, myself) if the forum had a thread that could combine the collective opinions on what might be good levelled units in various campaigns.

But that's exactly what the wiki is for.


Greetz
HomerJ

[Maiklas3000]

I had recently rewritten that section of the walkthrough for The Rise of Wesnoth, along with the rest of the walkthrough. In addition to rewording what was already there, I added the part where the unit recommendations are broken down by scenario (and your post reminded me to finish it up, so I just did.) Now it's a bit redundant and so could be condensed, but if you like it, then maybe I'll leave it alone for now.

[fredbobsmith2]

Ah yes I see that now, but I was referring to other campaigns. For instance, whether rangers or marksmen are more useful in HttT, how many levelled archers compared to fighters, etc. Yes the wiki does this, but it does not recommend a certain amount of which unit. So I go levelling whatever seems to be right and then I find that I need less of a certain unit and many more of another.

EDIT: Yes I found the tRoW wiki recommendations very helpful, thanks for that.

[shadowblack]

What units you will need depends both on what the enemy will recruit and on your playing style. Since there's no way to know these things ahead of time it's impossible to recommend exact amounts, only types of units that will be of use.

[fredbobsmith2]

Yes, but I meant what types of units would be useful overall. I see that playing style is important, but a list would guide my promotes in the right direction. Also, instead of actual amounts, I meant approximate ratios, ie, for me, one grand knight for every paladin in tRoW, only grand knights after ~3 paladins.

I made this thread after I realized, playing HttT, that most people had way more high archers than me throughout the campaign. The reason was because I dislike many archers as opposed to magi, due to playing style as mentioned, but I wondered why they might be helpful. So, I thought it might be useful to see what sort of units other people built up.

[tr0ll]

well i recall one fellow played HttT with nothing but shamans so it could totally depend on your style.
however if a campaign requires you to promote certain unconventional types of units for later scenarios, it will (or should) give you hints in the context of the game.

[CMaster]

There are some pros and contras for a uniform recall list.

Pro:
Some units are simply better than others in most situations. For example, I never level marksmen, I always use elvish rangers. Marksmen die too quickly while rangers add ambush and versatility (may also be used for mellee fights) to more durability. Same story for the lancer and the knight.

Contra:
You need to be prepared for almost everything. Using only a single unit type is bound to bring you in a situation, where that particular unit type sucks. Like crossing a river with dwarves, bad idea. Or defending with dodgy units against attacking mages. So, leveling many dwarvish lords is great, but if it's the only unit you've got, you may be in for disaster. Diversity allows you to use a different army for each scenario.

Contra:
Some specialist units are quite essential. Like a small number of healers, like some magical heavy hitters, like some flyers, like some scouts, ... The number of these units you want to use is quite limited, but surviving without can be next to impossible.

So my advice is:
One part of the recall list should be the specialist units, mainly healers. Decide how many of these you want to use, level them and protect them. This is a fixed number of units, though the exact number is a question of taste and style.

For the rest identify the strongest units you can get, identify their specific weaknesses and use a mix that allows you to fight well in a wide variety of situations.
If you can get dwarvish lords, get them.
-- But also provide for quick units and ranged units. The elvish ranger would be a good supplement.
If you can get elvish sylphs, get them.
-- But also provide for large fights with many units.
-- (By the way, if you add two elvish shydes, you get an amazingly hard hitting, magic, slowing, regenerating air force...)
If you can get paladins, get them (more versatile than the grand knight and basic healing).
-- But also provide units with pierce resistance and ranged attacks.
If you can get archmages, get them.
-- But also provide for damage soakers to protect them.

[fredbobsmith2]

Actually I was looking for some generally good recall lists like the sort listed here by kalis

http://forums.wesnoth.org/posting.php?m ... =3&t=32718

[PeterPorty]

Click your link, please.

[Spam]

Ah yes I see that now, but I was referring to other campaigns. For instance, whether rangers or marksmen are more useful in HttT, how many levelled archers compared to fighters, etc. Yes the wiki does this, but it does not recommend a certain amount of which unit. So I go levelling whatever seems to be right and then I find that I need less of a certain unit and many more of another.

EDIT: Yes I found the tRoW wiki recommendations very helpful, thanks for that.

HttT is my favorite campaign and one i've replayed a considerable number of times, so that I've got a fair amount of experience in different strategies for it, and I can tell you that unless you completely bone your leveling you should be able to beat it. The extreme length of the campaign pretty much assures you a very, very wide base of units as long as you consciously nurse a handful of level 1s along every scenario. That said, if you want some general tips

1) As with any campaign of this length I'd imagine, pay special attention to healers. In particular trying to get a Mage of Light or two pretty early on can be a pretty big deal. You're dealing with Chaotic units as opponents and using a fair amount of Lawful units the vast majority of the time. Some, such as the 12 turn survival scenario, benefit greatly from the units presence.

2) I don't typically bother with Silver Mages in HttT, because most scenarios involve rapid movement, often in formation, across hostile terrain. Meaning the ability to teleport from friendly village to friendly village is usually negligible. That said, there are a handful of scenarios where a strategy of dividing your army to attack multiple targets at once is either an optional victory condition or necessary. In these specific instances, a cadre of Silver Mages to serve as a shifting "punching power" could be useful. That said, because of the campaign length, you have plenty of time to get Great Mages, which is almost always my preference.

3) I like Grand Knights despite the supposed "lack of versatility" because they make excellent "gap-fillers" / HP-sinks. Until you get Dwarvish Lords, you simply won't get more HP for a unit then Grand Knights (and even then it's competitive). Their resistances aren't great, but you're forced to cross open terrain many times due to available terrain or simple time considerations (early finish bonuses are generally critical), making many of the resistances irrelevant anyways, and their mobility gives you flexibility.

4) Elvish Captains are not as useful as Elvish Heroes because of the high XP levels most of your units will achieve due to the campaign length. A Captain or two to help shepherd your "newbies" along that you add each scenario is the most you need, past that go with the heroes/champions.

5) There are two, maybe three (I forget) storm tridents in the game, try to level enough mermen fighters for that. Not super relevant to a recall list discussion though because at least the first two come so early (when you first get mermen and shortly thereafter again) that this should be apparent.

6) Elvish Scouts are nice leveled but generally it's not overly vital. More then any other leveled unit I found myself willing to sacrifice Elvish Outriders. They're easy to replace (level quickly that is) and generally serve mostly the function of finisher/scout/distraction, which the level 1 version can often fill adequately in and of itself. It's not that the Outrider isn't useful, it certainly is, it's just replaceable.

7) I also found Marksmen more useful then others apparently. Given the ease of acquiring Champions, Grand Knights, Marshals, Konrad himself, later Dwarvish Lords and Sentinels, etc, you have plenty of HP-sinks and have no reason to be using Archers for the purpose.

I found Sentinels too much of a pain in the ass to level/use, perfering Dwarvish Lords greatly to them. But I also generally play at the Normal difficulty and, from what I understand, the Stalwart is so much more necessary at Hard.

[Spam]

Yes, but I meant what types of units would be useful overall. I see that playing style is important, but a list would guide my promotes in the right direction. Also, instead of actual amounts, I meant approximate ratios, ie, for me, one grand knight for every paladin in tRoW, only grand knights after ~3 paladins.

I made this thread after I realized, playing HttT, that most people had way more high archers than me throughout the campaign. The reason was because I dislike many archers as opposed to magi, due to playing style as mentioned, but I wondered why they might be helpful. So, I thought it might be useful to see what sort of units other people built up.

That probably has more to do with the beginnings of the campaign, when you're largely limited to Elvish units and often facing Orcs. I lean more towards mages as well, generally using Grand Knights in conjunction whenever possible.

[monochromatic]

In general, for humans and elves in most situations I prefer archers over mages. Just FYI.

In HttT and LoW I put a heavy emphasis on, not archers or mages, but SHAMANS. The level 4 Slyph is one of my favorite units in the game. In addition to being hot, They are, compared to leveled mages: faster, better movetype, neutral arcane or pierce magic, slowing attacks, and more versatile. In HttT especially since you do face undead.

In terms of archers vs. mages, I tend to keep a 'heavy artillery' group of leveled mage-likes behind my forces, though few. Archers I regularly place with my normal troops. I vastly prefer archers to mages in general, partially because of my play style. Though leveled shamans fit the role better than both.

I almost regularly pick marksman over ranger unless I'm fighting many ranged based units (like drakes or elves in fact).

[taptap]

I am facing the question again. Sir Ruddry: Grand Knight or Paladin? (The Rise of Wesnoth)

[Velensk]

I almost always go for Grand Knight but either works fine.

I also almost always play through the midlands despite missing the much easier mission and loyal white mage (simply because I find it funner).