Am I using poachers the right way?

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ChibiDwarf
Posts: 42
Joined: October 12th, 2007, 10:53 am

Am I using poachers the right way?

Post by ChibiDwarf »

Recently I've noticed that against loyalties, I have developed a habbit of recruiting an excess amount of poaches and in a previous game, my entire army was composed of 99.9% poachers and that 0.1% was the gryphon rider I used for stealing villages and vision.
And most horrible at all, I manged to take down every thing the loyalties thrown at me. Mounted units with HI initially was a threat, but they aren't killing at least 1.4 poachers per turn, which I am producing, HI didn't even get a chance to attack before it gets surrounded entirely. Mages is about the only unit that manged to deal damage in the end, but it still isn't enough.

If I am a loyalty whom were to encounter a poacher infestation, what should I do to fight it back? Assume I know the infestation will come at the beginning of the game. Map used is charge(the only map I know)
Tonepoet
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Post by Tonepoet »

First, who were you playing? They don't sound highly skilled if they lose to unit spam of any sort. Singular units in Wesnoth all have highly exploitable weaknesses. Furthermore, do you have a replay for people to review?

Second of all, the Time of Day has a significant effect on gameplay. Units of different alignments get different fighting values during certain times of day. Units of lawful alignment get +25 damage during the day (morning and afternoon) and -25 at night (First Watch, Second Watch). For poachers, the reverse is true because they're of chaotic alignment. Both of these alignments have neutral fighting times (dawn and dusk) which do not give any bonuses or deductions in strength. H.I. have good resistance against the pierce so they are effective but you may also want to consider Bowmen, who will deal a considerably good amount of retaliation damage against the poacher for a decent price.

Terrain has a profound effect in games. Luck can decide the direction of any singular game as well. A combination of all the right factors, including the above coupled with player skill can greatly skewer any match-up. Because of this, it'd be nice for people to know what the "exact" situation is so they can see exactly what factors come into consideration. So again, replay please? It'd give all the prerequisite input without you requiring perfect recollection.

Finally, in a game against a competent player I doubt spamming only one kind of unit would have a desirable effect consistently. Perhaps luck would give a couple of games to people who spammed units with particularly high attack stats or defense but not often enough to consider it a viable tactic. The Poacher has very low statistics all 'round so in my honest and frank opinion, I think you were just playing better then your opponent. That, you got lucky or both even perhaps.
Caeb
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Post by Caeb »

the AI is not the best opponent for attempting to learn factional strategies, although it can be somewhat amusing to see what type of unit spams you can get away with... (like all Clashers against Undead when ghosts had cold dmg... :) )

try either spending some time with a (non-AI level) human player or giving the AI some extra gold, perhaps in increments of 25 for as long as you're able to keep winning... the former should show that you'll need more than just a single unit to win against any faction that is decently played, while the latter should teach you defensive/opportunistic-offensive strategies that will help you in competitive play...

it's nice to see that you're discovering the joys of using practically any strategy against the AI and winning, although you must know that the AI has the handicap of... being the AI... :P

(if you were playing a human, I'd say it was probably an AI-level player, and as such I stand by my post... :wink: )
ChibiDwarf
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Joined: October 12th, 2007, 10:53 am

Post by ChibiDwarf »

I was, actually, playing against myself. (i'm still not confident enough to play against others) That's why I'm asking for help on the loyalties because I don't know how to counter my own poacher infestation...
Velensk
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Post by Velensk »

Spearmen, with some mage support. Get 1 or 2 mages and serveral spearmen and position yourself so that at dawn you can beguin an assault. Don't be afraid to use mages on pouchers at day your 9-3 magic attack will blow their 3-4 out of their forests and strongholds. Spearmen will do decent damage and be able to take damage.
"There are two kinds of old men in the world. The kind who didn't go to war and who say that they should have lived fast died young and left a handsome corpse and the old men who did go to war and who say that there is no such thing as a handsome corpse."
Grand Marshal Aditya
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Post by Grand Marshal Aditya »

A few horsemen should pound the poachers.

The charge attack can pretty much kill in one round so the poachers should drop like flies...

But, you should try playing against others. Who cares if you lose? You can blame the RNG anyhow :lol:
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
ChibiDwarf
Posts: 42
Joined: October 12th, 2007, 10:53 am

Post by ChibiDwarf »

My apologies for the rackus caused. I actually had no problem dealing with poachers at all. This post was created in order to decieve and defeat my brother, knowing that he visits this forum frequently. But thanks for the various advice, I am sure I will be able to improve my play with all the suggestions.

P.S. My brother's expression was priceless when he saw a horde of HI charging at his poachers.
Caeb
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Post by Caeb »

ahh, well, deception is an integral part of the art of war... I'll give ya props for creativity in pursuing the utter destruction and/or humiliation of your enemies and/or siblings... :twisted:
Velensk
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Post by Velensk »

Grand Marshal Aditya wrote:A few horsemen should pound the poachers.

The charge attack can pretty much kill in one round so the poachers should drop like flies...

But, you should try playing against others. Who cares if you lose? You can blame the RNG anyhow :lol:
Not true a strong horseman at day olny does 25 per hit which is not enough to kill even a quick poucher in one hit. I do agree that you should practice against others though.
"There are two kinds of old men in the world. The kind who didn't go to war and who say that they should have lived fast died young and left a handsome corpse and the old men who did go to war and who say that there is no such thing as a handsome corpse."
ChibiDwarf
Posts: 42
Joined: October 12th, 2007, 10:53 am

Post by ChibiDwarf »

Well at the beginning I was forced to play this game as my brother's playmate. After getting hours of slaughter I decided to come up with this plan.
We do want to play online too, a 2v2 match is good. Though we can't seem to join the official server, so we're stuck with playing with each other.
P.S. I'm getting slaughtered twice as much now that he knew I was deceiving him.
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cool evil
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Joined: September 13th, 2007, 10:56 pm

Post by cool evil »

I suggest you take advantage of every system in wesnoth, that includes day/night cycle, terrain defense, ZOC(zone of control), and use them in your favor. Just station your units according to decent terrains and attack in your favor of the day. To defeat the enemy, recruit variety of units and scout/take villages, i can't really tell you how to play unless you know what map you are battling on and what your opponent's faction will be.

Post them here and maybe i'll take a look at it.
ChibiDwarf
Posts: 42
Joined: October 12th, 2007, 10:53 am

Post by ChibiDwarf »

There's no way I can beat my brother in this game unless I deceive him beforehand. He has plays computer games all the while I don't like it at all. Well that being that, at long as I take one win from him I'm satisfied.
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zookeeper
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Post by zookeeper »

ChibiDwarf wrote:There's no way I can beat my brother in this game unless I deceive him beforehand. He has plays computer games all the while I don't like it at all. Well that being that, at long as I take one win from him I'm satisfied.
Well if you can both agree that he can always beat you in a fair fight, then I'm sure you could also agree to for example give you a bit more gold to compensate?
ChibiDwarf
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Joined: October 12th, 2007, 10:53 am

Post by ChibiDwarf »

zookeeper wrote:
ChibiDwarf wrote:There's no way I can beat my brother in this game unless I deceive him beforehand. He has plays computer games all the while I don't like it at all. Well that being that, at long as I take one win from him I'm satisfied.
Well if you can both agree that he can always beat you in a fair fight, then I'm sure you could also agree to for example give you a bit more gold to compensate?
Highly unlikely. Well he just want payback for me forcing him to do something he doesn't want during a party last week...
Last edited by ChibiDwarf on October 14th, 2007, 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
bert1
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Post by bert1 »

While your brother may be your superior on the Wesnoth field, it seems you have the measure of him in other ways.
Good is simply that which is willed. - Eugene Halliday
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