Loyalists vs. Rebels

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shadowlord96
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Loyalists vs. Rebels

Post by shadowlord96 »

does the loyalists have an avantange agensent the rebles

Better Title.

-Maeglin Dubh
Last edited by shadowlord96 on December 20th, 2006, 3:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Becephalus »

no

There are advantages. You can use time of day to boost your stats in attacks, and then run when night comes, but these are all balanced by advantages on the other side. I think it is very balanced.
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Post by Blarumyrran »

yes
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F8 Binds...
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Post by F8 Binds... »

No there is no advantage on a regular map. No races have an advantage over another. If you lose consistently to a certain race, it has to do with your playing style, or you just aren't very good at this game yet. Certain players just do better with certain races. Example: I do better with elves, since they fit my playing style- guerilla tactics.
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Viliam
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Re: help

Post by Viliam »

shadowlord96 wrote:does the loyalists have an avantange agensent the rebles
You play Loyalists, and ask someone experienced to play Rebels against you. ;-) This will teach you how to play Rebels against Loyalists.

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Post by Fiach Dubh »

Very quick summary:

* The Rebel's major asset is the excellent mobility and defense of elven units in forests. In woody areas, you can run circles around any other faction.

* Your main fighting force is (hopefully) Elvish Fighters and Archers, both of which are neutral. Engage Loyalists during the night, or in twilight if necessary - try very hard to avoid fighting them in daylight.

* Mages, Horsemen and Elvish Scouts are not front-line units - use them to pick off enemies who are already near death.

* Woses aren't as useful as their powerful attack first suggests - they're very good for delaying an enemy advance though, and are lethal in woodland (as fast as, or faster than, most non-Elf units, and invisible too)

* Shamans should be near every battle, but generally not fighting - keep them back, shielded by ZoCs of better fighters, and pull wounded units back to them to be healed. ONLY use the slowing attack against units that can't retaliate, since Shamans get slaughtered if their enemy fights back.

Other players may (and probably will) disagree with some or all of this.
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F8 Binds...
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Post by F8 Binds... »

Fiach Dubh wrote:Very quick summary:

* The Rebel's major asset is the excellent mobility and defense of elven units in forests. In woody areas, you can run circles around any other faction.
True. Just don't forget their ranged specialty, considering 6/7 units get ranged attacks, and don't forget the trait "dextrous".
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Your main fighting force is (hopefully) Elvish Fighters and Archers, both of which are neutral. Engage Loyalists during the night, or in twilight if necessary - try very hard to avoid fighting them in daylight.
Yes, your force should mostly be EF's / EA's- but if he recruits HI / mages, you need to change your strategy. Loyalists are very versatile- you need to recruit carefully until you know what they are recruiting. This is pretty good advice.
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Mages, Horsemen and Elvish Scouts are not front-line units - use them to pick off enemies who are already near death.
Horsemen? Since when did rebels get horsemen? Nevertheless, I don't think you should use scouts to pick at / kill units near death- your other units have better leveling possiblities.
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Woses aren't as useful as their powerful attack first suggests - they're very good for delaying an enemy advance though, and are lethal in woodland (as fast as, or faster than, most non-Elf units, and invisible too)
They can be used to delay spearman / bowman / horseman, but I'm not sure about mages, HI, fencers, and calvaryman.
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Shamans should be near every battle, but generally not fighting - keep them back, shielded by ZoCs of better fighters, and pull wounded units back to them to be healed. ONLY use the slowing attack against units that can't retaliate, since Shamans get slaughtered if their enemy fights back.
Yes. Note that slowing HI works reasonably well due to recent reduced impact resistance, HI lack of a ranged attack, and that HI only get 2 strikes.
Fiach Dubh wrote:Other players may (and probably will) disagree with some or all of this.
For the most part, it's absolutely solid. It however isn't exactly what I would do.
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Post by Thrawn »

F8 Binds... wrote:
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Your main fighting force is (hopefully) Elvish Fighters and Archers, both of which are neutral. Engage Loyalists during the night, or in twilight if necessary - try very hard to avoid fighting them in daylight.
Yes, your force should mostly be EF's / EA's- but if he recruits HI / mages, you need to change your strategy. Loyalists are very versatile- you need to recruit carefully until you know what they are recruiting. This is pretty good advice.
also, don't let daytime scare you too much. you have ranged attacks, so feel free to continue picking off weakened enemies and attack units who can't counter. Remember, elves can just retreat through woods further than enemies can follow them, so as long as you play smart during the day, you can still continue fighting.
F8 Binds... wrote:
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Mages, Horsemen and Elvish Scouts are not front-line units - use them to pick off enemies who are already near death.
Horsemen? Since when did rebels get horsemen? Nevertheless, I don't think you should use scouts to pick at / kill units near death- your other units have better leveling possiblities.
situational, you want a scout or two around to pursue wounded enemies who could outrun you. They also can serve as a useful distraction, as they can run though broken lines and attack healing units/make the enmy fight a nuisance on their side of the lines, as to prevent advancing. I'd say make sure you have the option in case you need it.
F8 Binds... wrote:
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Woses aren't as useful as their powerful attack first suggests - they're very good for delaying an enemy advance though, and are lethal in woodland (as fast as, or faster than, most non-Elf units, and invisible too)
They can be used to delay spearman / bowman / horseman, but I'm not sure about mages, HI, fencers, and calvaryman.
keep them away from mages if at all possible, unless you are sure you can kill the mage that turn. (note, I'm not saying attack the mage with a wose: with only two attacks even a wounded mage can survive with only a touch of luck). Heavy Infantry are delayed by them. Do about the same, and woses heal (also note that woses are lawful)
F8 Binds... wrote:
Fiach Dubh wrote:* Shamans should be near every battle, but generally not fighting - keep them back, shielded by ZoCs of better fighters, and pull wounded units back to them to be healed. ONLY use the slowing attack against units that can't retaliate, since Shamans get slaughtered if their enemy fights back.
Yes. Note that slowing HI works reasonably well due to recent reduced impact resistance, HI lack of a ranged attack, and that HI only get 2 strikes.
Also, if you can, pick off wounded units with these: druids are really useful for defense, and the other branch for offense. Just make sure to keep them safe (don't pick off a wounded unit on the open front line: instead ZoC a wounded one and feed it to the shaman.)

Also, merman hunters can hold their own against loyalist mermen, just try to be the one on the lagoon :)

In other words, play smart :)
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this goes for they're/their/there as well

Greenmagisniper
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Post by Greenmagisniper »

The loyalists have some advantages to rebels and disadvantages as well but it only depends in what map your in and what your doing.

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Post by Cackfiend »

F8 Binds... wrote:No there is no advantage on a regular map. No races have an advantage over another. If you lose consistently to a certain race, it has to do with your playing style, or you just aren't very good at this game yet. Certain players just do better with certain races. Example: I do better with elves, since they fit my playing style- guerilla tactics.
apparently you've never played undead
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Lazarus
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Post by Lazarus »

You're right, he never has...
Certain players just do better with certain races.
Yeah, I agree.

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Post by Thrawn »

Cackfiend wrote:
F8 Binds... wrote:No there is no advantage on a regular map. No races have an advantage over another. If you lose consistently to a certain race, it has to do with your playing style, or you just aren't very good at this game yet. Certain players just do better with certain races. Example: I do better with elves, since they fit my playing style- guerilla tactics.
apparently you've never played undead
what are you trying to say, are overdead really powerful?

undead are as balanced as every other faction...people just don't know how to use/combat them if they always lose/win with them...

try playing some of the people you see giving advice here...you will soon learn that no faction pwns another in a fair fight...
...please remember that "IT'S" ALWAYS MEANS "IT IS" and "ITS" IS WHAT YOU USE TO INDICATE POSSESSION BY "IT".--scott

this goes for they're/their/there as well

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Post by Higher Game »

Undead sure are vicious, though. Like the Northerners, they have the first night attack advantage. Unlike the Northerners, they don't get weak over time, due to low quality units. In fact, when they get a "critical mass" of dark adepts, they seem to get even stronger over time! They enjoy two great level 0's as well. The zombies are cheap power with no upkeep and a good chance of getting killed and replaced on the spot, and the vampire bat is probably the game's best scout.

Since there's a new version I read about that has the dark adepts no longer getting the strong trait, it looks like they will be even more dangerous in the future. Even though the factions are pretty well balanced, the undead seem to have a psychological advantage. It's very fitting.

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Post by Cackfiend »

the general feeling ive gotten is that undead are the weakest faction

and most people tend to agree that loyalist are the best

IMO it would take a lot of luck for a good undead player to beat a good loyalist player

maybe people have replays to prove me differently?
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Post by Lazarus »

Higher Game wrote: The zombies are cheap power with no upkeep and a good chance of getting killed and replaced on the spot.
Are you kidding? Cheap, yes. Power...not exactly... :roll:

I mean come on! They've got an impact attack of 5-2! They have 0% resistance to all attacks - except holy(-100%)! :roll:

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