New features (WML, reasonable cannon, bodies..)

[aelius]

Actually, the Turin campaign I was talking about was Saving Elensefar (on the campaign server). It uses a world map that allows you to select scenarios to play by moving a hero around.

If you put something like the K'ailan script at the end of a scenario, you could pick the next scenario before a map is loaded.

Why are you dead set on making a choice in the storyline as opposed to during a scenario?

- b.

[szopen]

Actually, the Turin campaign I was talking about was Saving Elensefar (on the campaign server). It uses a world map that allows you to select scenarios to play by moving a hero around.

Umm I didn't see that campaign! Probably because it's not in standard pack I brwosed trough code for HttT, TroW, and lurked troough others.

Why are you dead set on making a choice in the storyline as opposed to during a scenario?

Because I haven't thought about solution made by Turin. I had to download it and check it.

I am not "dead set". I am not "dead set" on anything since i'm married . I thought just it would be nice to have large map without all those menus above, to emulate outlook of other games, like EU2 or Risk or whatever. Wesnoth is not and won't be of course neither, but i do not intend to do it, I just wanted to have campaign which would give a feeling of something similar.

[szopen]

just downloaded Saving elsenfar. Seems like it had some features I wished for Though I think it would be cleaner using tags I suggested lol

[Disto]

[quote="szopen]I am not "dead set". I am not "dead set" on anything since i'm married . I thought just it would be nice to have large map without all those menus above, to emulate outlook of other games, like EU2 or Risk or whatever. Wesnoth is not and won't be of course neither, but i do not intend to do it, I just wanted to have campaign which would give a feeling of something similar.[/quote]

Why should we emulate these other games, we are not them or similar to them in most ways. Why should we jump on the bandwagon and just be "one of those same games"

[aelius]

Indeed, there are many things in WML that aren't clean (yet). But they can certainly wait for 1.0 to be cleaned up. There's almost always a way to do what you're aiming for.

- b.

[szopen]

[quote="szopen]I am not "dead set". I am not "dead set" on anything since i'm married . I thought just it would be nice to have large map without all those menus above, to emulate outlook of other games, like EU2 or Risk or whatever. Wesnoth is not and won't be of course neither, but i do not intend to do it, I just wanted to have campaign which would give a feeling of something similar.

Why should we emulate these other games, we are not them or similar to them in most ways. Why should we jump on the bandwagon and just be "one of those same games"[/quote]

One thing is to ftry to force you to emulate, and another to made it possible for someone for do it.

AFAIK there is nothing similar to EU in Linux.

EDIT:
And, BTW, after browsing again in custom campaigns, I noticed that if IS implemented, though it is not mentioned in WML reference in www. Curses. Guess I look like a clueless moron right now

[ott]

How do you put labels on maps within story tags (on that large maps presenting whole continent etc) and why nobody is doing it?

See the DOT and CROSS macros in utils.cfg, which place images on top of the bigmap. This may give you some of what you are looking for, though without the benefits that text gives (like translatability). If you really can't tell the story without the text labels, then please go ahead and implement your patch together with your campaign -- a nice campaign would certainly be a good argument for including such code changes. But note -- this is for consideration after 1.0 only.

What I want, is to allow to made decision BEFORE loading any sceanrio map. That is, that you could made a choice before ANY map is loaded.

Right now, scenario maps are the primary interface the game presents to the user. As such, you need to make your user interface actions happen in the context of a scenario. See the Random Campaign on the campaign server for an example of how this can be made to work.

I wanted to implement campaigns in which you would have set of provinces to conquer. Order in which you are conquering provinces should be undetermined by campaign sceanrio.

See the Random Campaign for ideas how to go about this.

[zookeeper]

c) Basic [IF] in [story]. I would implement ONLY checking variable and maybe have_unit tag. It woudl allow to show different parts depending e.g. on whether some person would be alive or not.

This would be SO sweet! At present, you can't really have a different story text in case someone important died or if you got to choose something in the previous scenario if there's a lot of possible outcomes.

Practical example: in the final scenario of a campaign, defeat does not occur with the defeat of any of the NPC's (or even with the defeat of the PC!), because the ultimate victory can still be attained by destroying x, saving y or whatever is the main objective of the campaign. Depending on the number of NPC's or other variable events during the battle, you would probably end up with a very large number of different end dialogs and/or story texts, so you couldn't really just branch them off to separate epiloque scenarios. If you had [if] to use or even SOME variable substitution in the 'story' key, this would be easy.

[Disto]

1) New WML tags

a) textarea. The patch is already submitted, not yet accepted it seems

The rule of thumb for new WML is: is there a specific requirement for it, expressed convincingly by a campaign or MP map author? I haven't seen any such arguments, so my conclusion is that this is just another "cool" feature, and is unlikely to make it into the game. As an example, adding the [objectives] tag happened after it was a feature request, after several campaign devs expressed a desire to use it to replace klunky existing workarounds to do the same thing, and after some of the developers made it clear to me it would be a good idea to implement it.

b) Input in scenarios... If user clicks an area, the value of variable myvar is set to proper value. It could be used in campaigns to visually choose next scenario (e.g. in HttT you could've pick a which road to choose).

Again, this sounds "cool" but without any need from campaign authors, it is unlikely to progress.

c) Basic [IF] in [story]. I would implement ONLY checking variable and maybe have_unit tag. It woudl allow to show different parts depending e.g. on whether some person would be alive or not.

This sounds like it could be worthwhile, try to canvass some support for it from a campaign author.

2) Reasonable cannon

See the Watch Tower. As pointed out already, this used to have a 5 hex multihex attack. As I understand, no-one could make the AI understand multihex attacks properly, and multihex attacks were removed as a source of lots of bugs without any real compensation in the form of an improved game.

Cannons emphatically would NOT be used in any of current scenarios.

Watch Towers are used in SotBE. Unfortunately, without multihex attacks they are currently a bit odd.

3) Bodies

This was last discussed on the forums a few months ago, and rejected.

It would be great if you could contribute. Right now we are trying to get to 1.0 in the short term. Have a look at the 78 open bugs, or even some of the 126 open feature requests for a list of contributions that would be likely to be welcomed.

Ott, C would be so useful for me, as i'm going to have to make 9 clones of a scenario, as my campaign is not linear, i've already got several scenarios which have clones that could need this.

[scott]

Can I use this thread to add a WML request?

It pertains to AMLA. Right now, AMLA advancements can be set to expire with max_times. It would be extremely useful if advancements could be set that did not show up until a certain number of advancements had passed.

For example, you can have an HP advancement that expires after 100 times, but an attack damage boost advancement that does not appear until the 3rd AMLA and is valid only once.

I don't know what you would name the key. Maybe advancement_delay= or delay=.

[Dave]

There is no problem with code maintance.

There are always problems with code maintenance.

[Darth Fool]

Can I use this thread to add a WML request?

It pertains to AMLA. Right now, AMLA advancements can be set to expire with max_times. It would be extremely useful if advancements could be set that did not show up until a certain number of advancements had passed.

For example, you can have an HP advancement that expires after 100 times, but an attack damage boost advancement that does not appear until the 3rd AMLA and is valid only once.

I don't know what you would name the key. Maybe advancement_delay= or delay=.

Given that this is a bump of a pretty old thread, I would make a new thread (or get a moderator to split this post.) In direct answer to your question, this could be done, but there are several technical details, to work out in the meaning. What first comes to mind is what happens for amla's that have more than 1 max_times? Does an advancement delay of 5 mean that they all become available on the 5th amla, or do they become available on the 5th, 10th, 15th, etc... amla? Another question is how would we want to display what AMLAs have taken place. Maybe display it in the level like: level 3(5) or maybe add icons to the image (stars, skulls, something specific to the type of AMLA?.)

[Disto]

I bumped it because ott said about having a campaign designer need C.