Mermen Tree Proposal

miyo · Post by **miyo** » August 24th, 2004, 7:41 pm

This far we have gotten with swamp, shallow water and deep water... and current defense types. We get complaints that Wesnoth is too hard... and now you people want to make it even more complex (which in my opinion makes it more harder as there are more factors to take in account).

Soon we need different levels of "air" so that air based units can be attacked with melee units if they are in ground or flying low... can be attacked only with ranged if they are flying medium... and can not be attacked except by other flying units when they are flying high.

- Miyo

Post by **Neoriceisgood** » August 24th, 2004, 7:43 pm

So? =) Water battles don't take place alot, and this would make em slightly more interesting; am I right or am I right?

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » August 24th, 2004, 7:46 pm

miyo wrote:This far we have gotten with swamp, shallow water and deep water... and current defense types. We get complaints that Wesnoth is too hard... and now you people want to make it even more complex (which in my opinion makes it more harder as there are more factors to take in account).

Soon we need different levels of "air" so that air based units can be attacked with melee units if they are in ground or flying low... can be attacked only with ranged if they are flying medium... and can not be attacked except by other flying units when they are flying high.

- Miyo

Major difference: Air is not a terrain.

Post by **Neoriceisgood** » August 24th, 2004, 7:50 pm

miyo wrote:
Soon we need different levels of "air" so that air based units can be attacked with melee units if they are in ground or flying low... can be attacked only with ranged if they are flying medium... and can not be attacked except by other flying units when they are flying high.

- Miyo

Major difference: Air is not a terrain.[/quote]

I proposed this to Dave once

but I included if units would land or not if they ended a flight, he just thought it was to complicated; and I agreed.

miyo · Post by **miyo** » August 24th, 2004, 7:52 pm

You guys quite often miss the point.

It was about adding more and more complex things... not about "air is not terrain"

- Miyo

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » August 24th, 2004, 7:54 pm

miyo wrote:You guys quite often miss the point.

It was about adding more and more complex things... not about "air is not terrain"

- Miyo

Elves have good defense in forest, Dwarves have good defense in mountains, Yetis have good defense in tundra, why should sea monsters not have good defense in deep water? How is that more complex?

Post by **Neoriceisgood** » August 24th, 2004, 7:55 pm

It's the magic of ignorance, so who is actualy in charge of finishing this three ? Jetryl ? Someone?

miyo · Post by **miyo** » August 24th, 2004, 8:02 pm

Elvish Pillager wrote:Elves have good defense in forest, Dwarves have good defense in mountains, Yetis have good defense in tundra, why should sea monsters not have good defense in deep water?

That was not my point either. Second miss. One more and you are out of the game (at least if we play "baseball" with finnish rules).

Treefolk have pretty poor defense on all terrains because InsertYourFavoreReasonForThisInHere.

- Miyo

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » August 24th, 2004, 8:16 pm

miyo wrote:That was not my point either. Second miss. One more and you are out of the game (at least if we play "baseball" with finnish rules).

A) What was your point?
B) What game?

Christophe33 · Post by **Christophe33** » August 24th, 2004, 9:19 pm

Adding new terrain doesn't make the game harder since it influence just the same basic parameters: mvt cost and defense but it adds diversity and can improve the tactic aspect of the game. If people wants more water based units, maps and scenario, adding some more terrain is logic too.
Ford and bridges are actually nice mix of land/water terrain but you could add mangrove (forest/swamp?), reef, kelp (underwater forest?), vortex (impassible for most water units)...
Miyo: do people complain that the rules of BfW are hard to understand or that it is hard to win?

Post by **turin** » August 24th, 2004, 9:30 pm

Adding more terrains does not make the game better, because you quickly end up repeating yourself. There are 10 different defenses and 5 sane movement values. Pretty soon you won't be able to find a way to distinguish terrains. Already, there is little difference between swamp and shallow water.

Adding water-based terrain makes even less sense, since this is a mostly land-based game. The focus should stay on the land, and we shouldn't add water terrains just because we can.

Dacyn · Post by **Dacyn** » August 24th, 2004, 9:33 pm

Christophe33 wrote:Adding new terrain

who's talking about adding a new terrain? That was an example.

I don't think adding new terrains is a good idea; changing movetypes is another matter.

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » August 24th, 2004, 9:34 pm

What? Nobody suggested new terrains IIRC...

Dacyn · Post by **Dacyn** » August 24th, 2004, 9:36 pm

Elvish Pillager wrote:What? Nobody suggested new terrains IIRC...

Someone suggested an air terrain

Post by **quartex** » August 24th, 2004, 10:22 pm

miyo wrote:This far we have gotten with swamp, shallow water and deep water... and current defense types. We get complaints that Wesnoth is too hard... and now you people want to make it even more complex (which in my opinion makes it more harder as there are more factors to take in account).

Soon we need different levels of "air" so that air based units can be attacked with melee units if they are in ground or flying low... can be attacked only with ranged if they are flying medium... and can not be attacked except by other flying units when they are flying high.

- Miyo

The whole point of miyo's post is that we don't want to make the game more complex by adding more water terrains. Yes, there are only 3 terrains for water units, but I think the emphasis should be on land units. If we have too many terrain types things will get too complex, or else we'll just start repeating ourselves, as new terrains have the same stats as old ones.