Changing level 0 units
Moderator: Forum Moderators
Changing level 0 units
it seems stupid to me that the removing of level 0 units' ZoC is hardwired into the definition of level 0 units. It makes it impossible to make a level 0 unit have a ZoC, which would be desirable, for example, in the Imperial Era.
The solution would be to remove this "feature" from the definition of level 0 units, and instead give it to all level 0 units as a specialty - call it "novice" or something, and make it remove the unit's ZoC. Then, you can have level 0 units that DO have ZoCs, simply by not giving them this specialty. This would also allow you to have level 1, 2, 3 or 4 units that don't have ZoCs, which might be desirable in some situations.
The solution would be to remove this "feature" from the definition of level 0 units, and instead give it to all level 0 units as a specialty - call it "novice" or something, and make it remove the unit's ZoC. Then, you can have level 0 units that DO have ZoCs, simply by not giving them this specialty. This would also allow you to have level 1, 2, 3 or 4 units that don't have ZoCs, which might be desirable in some situations.
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
Xan has just informed me that this has been implemented in SVN. It works like this:
<Xan|> under the [unit] tag of unit types
<Xan|> if zoc=yes, that unit will have a ZoC, no matter what
<Xan|> if zoc key exist, but != yes, that unit will not have ZoC
<zookeeper> so it doesn't change anything current? yay
<Xan|> if zoc key does not exist it will have zoc only if level > 0
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
- Eleazar
- Retired Terrain Art Director
- Posts: 2481
- Joined: July 16th, 2004, 1:47 am
- Location: US Midwest
- Contact:
Another thing that's wierd about L0 units is they still cost 20GP to recall.
I know all units cost 20GP to recall, but since L0 usually cost about half that in the first place, it seems like they should cost less. Unless they have the perfect traits, i don't see much point in recalling them.
I know all units cost 20GP to recall, but since L0 usually cost about half that in the first place, it seems like they should cost less. Unless they have the perfect traits, i don't see much point in recalling them.
Feel free to PM me if you start a new terrain oriented thread. It's easy for me to miss them among all the other art threads.
-> What i might be working on
Attempting Lucidity
-> What i might be working on
Attempting Lucidity
Maybe the recall cost should be the unit's cost if it's less than 20 gold?Eleazar wrote:Another thing that's wierd about L0 units is they still cost 20GP to recall.
I know all units cost 20GP to recall, but since L0 usually cost about half that in the first place, it seems like they should cost less. Unless they have the perfect traits, i don't see much point in recalling them.
"If gameplay requires it, they can be made to live on Venus." -- scott
- Eleazar
- Retired Terrain Art Director
- Posts: 2481
- Joined: July 16th, 2004, 1:47 am
- Location: US Midwest
- Contact:
Since L1-5 units all cost 20GP to recall, (reguardless of their original price) i think that all L0 units should all have the same recall cost-- 10GP perhaps?Soliton wrote:Maybe the recall cost should be the unit's cost if it's less than 20 gold?Eleazar wrote:Another thing that's wierd about L0 units is they still cost 20GP to recall.
I know all units cost 20GP to recall, but since L0 usually cost about half that in the first place, it seems like they should cost less. Unless they have the perfect traits, i don't see much point in recalling them.
With a some XP (assuming you are happy with the traits) a recalled L1-L5 unit is almost always a better deal for your Gold than a fresh recruit. IMHO recalling L0 units should also be more cost effective than recruiting new ones.
Feel free to PM me if you start a new terrain oriented thread. It's easy for me to miss them among all the other art threads.
-> What i might be working on
Attempting Lucidity
-> What i might be working on
Attempting Lucidity
They generally take very little xp to level though, so they don't remain level 0 for long, generally.Eleazar wrote:Another thing that's wierd about L0 units is they still cost 20GP to recall.
I know all units cost 20GP to recall, but since L0 usually cost about half that in the first place, it seems like they should cost less. Unless they have the perfect traits, i don't see much point in recalling them.
Now you mention it, there is something strange about recalls. They sometimes cost less than it is to recruit. Like the gryphon : it costs 24 gold, but it is only 20 in recall, while as you mentionned lvl0 ones become very expensive.
Maybe recalling could be changed and would be recruit price + (additionnal expense depending on the level of the unit).
Maybe recalling could be changed and would be recruit price + (additionnal expense depending on the level of the unit).
"There are two kind of campaign strategies : the good and the bad ones. The good ones almost always fail because of unforeseen consequences that make the bad ones succeed." -- Napoleon
OFWRA.
It wasn't exactly a flamewar, but it has been discussed to death, especially the flexible recall cost.
It wasn't exactly a flamewar, but it has been discussed to death, especially the flexible recall cost.
Hope springs eternal.
Wesnoth acronym guide.
Wesnoth acronym guide.
Level 0 units have always been a bit of an abberition. They broke several standards in wesnoth (ZoC, recall, upkeep) and the current comprimise was decidad as the best of an imperfect situation. I think further changes are unlikely, unless people agree that there are major balance problems.
Creator of Under the Burning Suns
An interesting and related abberation existed in Starcraft. In starcraft, your forces had a maximum upkeep business - you needed to have a certain number of support structures to hire a certain number of troops.
All units cost 1 or more upkeep. Many cost 2 (the zerg ultralisk cost 4).
Except for two. The zerg race's "zergling" and "scourge, their swarming melee/kamikaze units, essentially cost 1/2. They would never show this, and I'm not sure how they rounded things. Interestingly enough, you could only buy them in 1-upkeep increments. When you purchased them, you got them in batches of two.
I mention this as food for thought.
All units cost 1 or more upkeep. Many cost 2 (the zerg ultralisk cost 4).
Except for two. The zerg race's "zergling" and "scourge, their swarming melee/kamikaze units, essentially cost 1/2. They would never show this, and I'm not sure how they rounded things. Interestingly enough, you could only buy them in 1-upkeep increments. When you purchased them, you got them in batches of two.
I mention this as food for thought.
- Eleazar
- Retired Terrain Art Director
- Posts: 2481
- Joined: July 16th, 2004, 1:47 am
- Location: US Midwest
- Contact:
discussion of how to visually display ZoC split off here.
Feel free to PM me if you start a new terrain oriented thread. It's easy for me to miss them among all the other art threads.
-> What i might be working on
Attempting Lucidity
-> What i might be working on
Attempting Lucidity