How about a BEAST FACTION?

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Doc Paterson
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Post by Doc Paterson »

Monkey wrote:
This beast faction idea is idiotic, beasts don't just join together. But there could be some beasts to make the game more fun.
Beasts effing LOVE joining together. Wolf-packs. Lion prides. Ape clans. (that's right, APE CLANS 8) )Sometimes they use really solid pack tactics, tricks, ambushes and the like....but you must know that. I'm not saying that your average mongoose family could wage war on the Loyalists, but really- Who's to say how smart or strong a beast in an imaginary universe could be? Also, I don't think realism is such a huge obstacle here, i.e. it seems silly to make the argument that beasts wouldn't have the intelligence to work together, in a world where men are already shooting magical bolts from their hands and battling tree-folk. :)

As I've said though, this is just something that would amuse me. I enjoy the game as it is and have a lot of fun with it.
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Post by Glowing Fish »

Well, its true, that if trees, which have no central nervous systems, can form into factions, so can mongooses. Or Mongeese.
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Post by Monkey »

then you must line the difference between beasts and animals
beasts can be drakes, mermaids, gryphons, and they join with their kind. animals are dogs, lions, monkeys, and althought some of them like monkeys can join together, they are not intelligent.
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Post by Doc Paterson »

Monkey wrote: you must line the difference.
Line the difference. I like that a lot. :D

I think of "beast" as being more general than "animal." "Animal," I think, says something about the intelligence, whereas with "beast," it's more ambiguous.

BE YE MAN OR BEAST? 8)
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Post by khamul »

HttT has something very close to a Beast faction anyway: there are rogue mages on Mountain Pass and Valley of Statues summoning Gryphons, Trolls, Cockatrice, Vampire Bats etc.

A Rogue Mage faction doesn't seem too far out of the Wesnoth ethos. You could probably even lever a Minotaur in there as an unholy half-man half-beast creation.

Need to be careful about balance though.
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Post by Simons Mith »

The Rogue Mage faction is a novel idea. I like it.
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by Honsay »

I was actually thinking of a Beast faction before I came across this post.

Instead of just throwing a bunch of random creatures all together without linking it, maybe there could be some back story along with it. Maybe the leader of the faction could be something akin to the Beast Master hero from Warcraft 3: The Frozen Throne. That could wrap everything together. Whoever made the faction wouldn't even have to make whole new units, they could just recycle the monsters from the unit list here http://units.wesnoth.org/1.4/tree_monster.html (The Beast Master graphic could just be an edit of another unit). Balancing would be a snap, because most of the monster units don't have ranged attacks anyway, and the price for some of the more powerful units (a.k.a Fire Dragon, Yeti) could be atrociously high. Otherwise, you could pay a low price for hordes of weak Mudcrawlers who have no melee attack.

I personally don't know WML or anything about developing a faction, but I think it'd be easy. What do you think?
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by Aethaeryn »

Honsay wrote:I was actually thinking of a Beast faction before I came across this post.

Instead of just throwing a bunch of random creatures all together without linking it, maybe there could be some back story along with it. Maybe the leader of the faction could be something akin to the Beast Master hero from Warcraft 3: The Frozen Throne. That could wrap everything together. Whoever made the faction wouldn't even have to make whole new units, they could just recycle the monsters from the unit list here http://units.wesnoth.org/1.4/tree_monster.html (The Beast Master graphic could just be an edit of another unit). Balancing would be a snap, because most of the monster units don't have ranged attacks anyway, and the price for some of the more powerful units (a.k.a Fire Dragon, Yeti) could be atrociously high. Otherwise, you could pay a low price for hordes of weak Mudcrawlers who have no melee attack.

I personally don't know WML or anything about developing a faction, but I think it'd be easy. What do you think?
I made a monster faction a while back, not for any real purposes. It allowed you to recruit monsters. Of course, for 100g you could rush the enemy with a fire dragon and win easily. The prices would have to be changed (requires new unit code, and thus requires download to play with this faction), and you can't even promote a monster so it winds up taking away an important part of Wesnoth. So in the end you'd have to create new previous/later levels, etc., balance the prices, and so forth. All of that work for a bunch of loosely-linked monsters when you could make a new faction with a theme that works better.

And this is a very old thread. Sometimes you need to use some common sense, it would've been better to make your own thread for a different idea made 3 years later than revive an old one.
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by Neoskel »

There is an awesome sprite for lvl 0/1 baby giant spider in the Ooze mini-campaign. Could be useful.
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by Aethaeryn »

Neoskel wrote:There is an awesome sprite for lvl 0/1 baby giant spider in the Ooze mini-campaign. Could be useful.
Yes, and I made a similar sprite for a lvl 0 scorpion a while back, it's on my contribs page in the wiki.
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by Honsay »

Aethaeryn wrote:And this is a very old thread. Sometimes you need to use some common sense, it would've been better to make your own thread for a different idea made 3 years later than revive an old one.
I know it's an old thread. If I had started a new one, it probably would have been shot down by other people saying "Another one! It's already been discussed before, and the answer was no". I thought it to be wiser to continue the thread, then the people who started it would be able to come back to something they thought was good before, but with in a new light (Compare the ideas of the original poster with mine. Big difference).

It just seemed that everybody in Wesnoth is siding with other people and making these huge armies to clash. Whatever happened to the little guy? The loner? The hermit? A story that involves some lone animal trainer sort of guy would have some interesting story opportunities. You can tie most anything together if you stretch the rope far enough.

Again, this is just an suggestion. Of course a unit like the Fire Dragon would have to either be toned down allot, or would have to have their price VERY high. Besides, even if this doesn't work out (which it appears it won't), do you have any better ideas for a faction that hasn't been done yet?
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by Aethaeryn »

Honsay wrote:I know it's an old thread. If I had started a new one, it probably would have been shot down by other people saying "Another one! It's already been discussed before, and the answer was no". I thought it to be wiser to continue the thread, then the people who started it would be able to come back to something they thought was good before, but with in a new light (Compare the ideas of the original poster with mine. Big difference).
Yes, so instead you're being shot down for resurrecting an old thread and having a big difference with the "ideas of the original poster." You must have been reading too much of the Ideas forum and not enough of this, this is for things that are more than ideas - actual work on factions. No faction is rejected unless no one works on it, no one can say "no" to you and have any weight unless you want to add it to the Default Era or another era in mainline Wesnoth.
Honsay wrote:It just seemed that everybody in Wesnoth is siding with other people and making these huge armies to clash. Whatever happened to the little guy? The loner? The hermit? A story that involves some lone animal trainer sort of guy would have some interesting story opportunities. You can tie most anything together if you stretch the rope far enough.

Again, this is just an suggestion. Of course a unit like the Fire Dragon would have to either be toned down allot, or would have to have their price VERY high.
Almost everyone's full of ideas, they don't make concepts based on other people's ideas most often: if you want a faction, make it, don't suggest it. You can ask for help in making the faction, but merely giving an idea that sounds cool or unique and then hoping someone makes it for you isn't going to work.
Honsay wrote:Besides, even if this doesn't work out (which it appears it won't), do you have any better ideas for a faction that hasn't been done yet?
Yes, which I am currently working on.
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by rchandra »

Aethaeryn wrote:
And this is a very old thread. Sometimes you need to use some common sense, it would've been better to make your own thread for a different idea made 3 years later than revive an old one.
But then I wouldn't have gotten to see a very different Doc Paterson. It was quite a shock; especially so since the date was relatively recent in the year, and "2005" can look like "2008" if you really want it to :).
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Re:

Post by JW »

turin wrote:The author seemed to not be serious about this idea at all. I mean, look at this:
Gigantic fiddler crabs with stone hammers that can level a forest space and turn it into grassland! Tusks! Claws! Teeth! BEASTS! BEASTS! BEASTS!
I responded to an unserious question with an unserious reply.
LAWL!!!

Totally worth the necromancy IMO. :lol2:

Turin used to be an ass. :wink:
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Re: How about a BEAST FACTION?

Post by DEATH_is_undead »

Glad to see Doc has changed... A lot...
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