The Qesicans (Development Stage: Art/Submission to the EE)

[lu_zero]

Fella's I hate to be blunt, but im not learning any new platforms for wesnoth.

I'll do what I can with windows, and be as helpful as I can be, given the circumstances, but I cannot develop the energy to learn new tricks.

Curmudgeonly though I may be, I simply am not going to go through that much effort.
-Qes

Please use 7zip (that's a windows application) and make a tar of your era.

[Qes]

Fella's I hate to be blunt, but im not learning any new platforms for wesnoth.

I'll do what I can with windows, and be as helpful as I can be, given the circumstances, but I cannot develop the energy to learn new tricks.

Curmudgeonly though I may be, I simply am not going to go through that much effort.
-Qes

Please use 7zip (that's a windows application) and make a tar of your era.

I might do that. I just relocated cities, and have to bring up to snuff all my computer stuff to wesnoth.

When Im finished I'll look into that.


EDIT: The Qesican's also do fairly poorly on survival maps, it would appear.


-Qes

[irrevenant]

Wow, you got a faction from start to finish in less than a month. That's a pretty impressive effort!!

[Qes]

Wow, you got a faction from start to finish in less than a month. That's a pretty impressive effort!!

Thanks! I appreciate it. Though "finished" still lacks nice art. But then again, that's normal.
Still - I dream of some wondrous artist to take pity upon the poor Qesicans and give them the love they so richly deserve.

Ce la vie,
-Qes

[MDG]

Wow, you got a faction from start to finish in less than a month. That's a pretty impressive effort!!

Thanks! I appreciate it. Though "finished" still lacks nice art. But then again, that's normal.
Still - I dream of some wondrous artist to take pity upon the poor Qesicans and give them the love they so richly deserve.

Ce la vie,
-Qes

Indeed, nicely done Qes. You did it your way and got there. Sweet. Hope you get some more art at some point or get stuck in if you have the time and inclination.

[Gresnor]

"C'est la vie"

It wouldn't bother me so much if I didn't take four years of french in HS.

[Qes]

OK I'm back - Internet is working.

Thoughts on the Qesican's I want opinions on:

1. Should monks get 1 more attack and be a 5-4?

2. Make Monks Less expensive or give them better defenses in various terrain?

3. Should Scouts, Ballista get an additional attack? (for answered damage) OR should roundshields get more HP?

4. Should the Pebblemancer --> Gravimancer line do more damage?

5. Should I add a couple 4th Level units?



Reasons for each:
1. The Qesican's lack "punch" in their first level units. The ballista is really the only damage-inflicter at level 1. Giving the monks an additional damage per attack would provide additional "punch" pun intended. The counter argument is that the majority of damage-output for the Qesican's lies in the second tier and not the first tier units.

2. Monks are great healers - but hard to justify outside of that. They get picked off in the open, they dont have the HP to contend with other "basic" units the enemy throws at them, and their damage is small enough where they arnt a good option for melee damage. As such, should they be cheapened or given better defenses? The counter argument is because IF they DO level, they're upgrades are fantastic.

3. A) A full half of Qesican recruitables do not get strong as an ability. So its pretty easy to get 1 of the 3 remaining. Which limits variety - never a good thing (except for the undead). B) The Qesican's in particular are suseptable to unanswered damage, as the Ballista, Scout, Roundshield and Monk are all subject to either one or the other ranges. Giving the Scouts or Ballista a secondary attack would bring some answered damage into equasions. Or, giving the Roundshield more HP would strengthen their position as the "meat" of the Qesican lines, and force Qesican Tactics to center around using Roundshields to survive the enemy while using other units to confuse, disable, or kill the enemy.

4. Pebblemancers are designed for accurate and "assured" damage. But as is, in many cases other things are more reliable (for sheer amounts of damage). And in many cases the pebblemancer's line is so frail that it's typically a better option to go the Warmancer line as it at least has slow.
I'd like blademancers and the like to be melovolant on the field - so feedback is appreciated.


5. Considering that the Qesicans are all about "advancing" and "adapting" having 1 or 2 fourth level units might suit them pretty well. As it's generally fairly simple to kill level 2's with level 1's of other factions, a level 4 would roughly be a powerful level 3 in balance terms.

Thanks all,
-Qes

[lu_zero]

more lv4 would be good

[Clonkinator]

OK I'm back - Internet is working.

Thoughts on the Qesican's I want opinions on:

1. Should monks get 1 more attack and be a 5-4?

2. Make Monks Less expensive or give them better defenses in various terrain?

3. Should Scouts, Ballista get an additional attack? (for answered damage) OR should roundshields get more HP?

4. Should the Pebblemancer --> Gravimancer line do more damage?

5. Should I add a couple 4th Level units?



Reasons for each:
1. The Qesican's lack "punch" in their first level units. The ballista is really the only damage-inflicter at level 1. Giving the monks an additional damage per attack would provide additional "punch" pun intended. The counter argument is that the majority of damage-output for the Qesican's lies in the second tier and not the first tier units.

2. Monks are great healers - but hard to justify outside of that. They get picked off in the open, they dont have the HP to contend with other "basic" units the enemy throws at them, and their damage is small enough where they arnt a good option for melee damage. As such, should they be cheapened or given better defenses? The counter argument is because IF they DO level, they're upgrades are fantastic.

3. A) A full half of Qesican recruitables do not get strong as an ability. So its pretty easy to get 1 of the 3 remaining. Which limits variety - never a good thing (except for the undead). B) The Qesican's in particular are suseptable to unanswered damage, as the Ballista, Scout, Roundshield and Monk are all subject to either one or the other ranges. Giving the Scouts or Ballista a secondary attack would bring some answered damage into equasions. Or, giving the Roundshield more HP would strengthen their position as the "meat" of the Qesican lines, and force Qesican Tactics to center around using Roundshields to survive the enemy while using other units to confuse, disable, or kill the enemy.

4. Pebblemancers are designed for accurate and "assured" damage. But as is, in many cases other things are more reliable (for sheer amounts of damage). And in many cases the pebblemancer's line is so frail that it's typically a better option to go the Warmancer line as it at least has slow.
I'd like blademancers and the like to be melovolant on the field - so feedback is appreciated.


5. Considering that the Qesicans are all about "advancing" and "adapting" having 1 or 2 fourth level units might suit them pretty well. As it's generally fairly simple to kill level 2's with level 1's of other factions, a level 4 would roughly be a powerful level 3 in balance terms.

Thanks all,
-Qes

Alright, I think I'll try to give you some recommendations on this.

1. Maybe 1 more damage per attack is an idea, but it would make its advancements a little less useful. But then again, hey, who cares? If they just don't survive you won't get to see their advancements. I'd recommend this:
* Raise melee damage by 1.
* Raise XP required to level by 5.
That should be a fair compromise.

2. My recommendation on 1 should basically solve this one as well. Other than that: Elvish shamans are weak. Okay, they have slow and 70% defense at forest, but they CAN be leveled fairly easily. If your monks don't get enough XP to level before they die, try to use them a bit more like elvish shamans (or healers, that is.)

3. A) Add a few custom traits. It should not be too hard to think of some. If it is, however, you'll surely find some ideas in the ideas forum.
B) Raising the roundshield's HP is a... ...bad idea. The roundshield is supposed to be hard to bring down, but not impossible. You might consider giving the roundshield line +10% resistance to impact damage, though (as the lvl1 roundshield has no resistance to impact at all yet afaik). That should already help.

4. Hmmm... I don't really have an idea what to do about this one, but I'd say, one more damage at melee and one more attack at ranged for the line should be okay (not for the line that trades in strikes for damage, though).

5. That surely is a good idea. However, you have to keep them balanced. Maybe it's better to forget this idea for now.

I hope I've been able to help you a bit. And please hurry at creating a 1.2.x-version of the quesicans, I wanna play them! Or maybe it's time to include them into the extended era...?

[Qes]

OK I'm back - Internet is working.

Thoughts on the Qesican's I want opinions on:

1. Should monks get 1 more attack and be a 5-4?

2. Make Monks Less expensive or give them better defenses in various terrain?

3. Should Scouts, Ballista get an additional attack? (for answered damage) OR should roundshields get more HP?

4. Should the Pebblemancer --> Gravimancer line do more damage?

5. Should I add a couple 4th Level units?



Reasons for each:
1. The Qesican's lack "punch" in their first level units. The ballista is really the only damage-inflicter at level 1. Giving the monks an additional damage per attack would provide additional "punch" pun intended. The counter argument is that the majority of damage-output for the Qesican's lies in the second tier and not the first tier units.

2. Monks are great healers - but hard to justify outside of that. They get picked off in the open, they dont have the HP to contend with other "basic" units the enemy throws at them, and their damage is small enough where they arnt a good option for melee damage. As such, should they be cheapened or given better defenses? The counter argument is because IF they DO level, they're upgrades are fantastic.

3. A) A full half of Qesican recruitables do not get strong as an ability. So its pretty easy to get 1 of the 3 remaining. Which limits variety - never a good thing (except for the undead). B) The Qesican's in particular are suseptable to unanswered damage, as the Ballista, Scout, Roundshield and Monk are all subject to either one or the other ranges. Giving the Scouts or Ballista a secondary attack would bring some answered damage into equasions. Or, giving the Roundshield more HP would strengthen their position as the "meat" of the Qesican lines, and force Qesican Tactics to center around using Roundshields to survive the enemy while using other units to confuse, disable, or kill the enemy.

4. Pebblemancers are designed for accurate and "assured" damage. But as is, in many cases other things are more reliable (for sheer amounts of damage). And in many cases the pebblemancer's line is so frail that it's typically a better option to go the Warmancer line as it at least has slow.
I'd like blademancers and the like to be melovolant on the field - so feedback is appreciated.


5. Considering that the Qesicans are all about "advancing" and "adapting" having 1 or 2 fourth level units might suit them pretty well. As it's generally fairly simple to kill level 2's with level 1's of other factions, a level 4 would roughly be a powerful level 3 in balance terms.

Thanks all,
-Qes

Alright, I think I'll try to give you some recommendations on this.

1. Maybe 1 more damage per attack is an idea, but it would make its advancements a little less useful. But then again, hey, who cares? If they just don't survive you won't get to see their advancements. I'd recommend this:
* Raise melee damage by 1.
* Raise XP required to level by 5.
That should be a fair compromise.

2. My recommendation on 1 should basically solve this one as well. Other than that: Elvish shamans are weak. Okay, they have slow and 70% defense at forest, but they CAN be leveled fairly easily. If your monks don't get enough XP to level before they die, try to use them a bit more like elvish shamans (or healers, that is.)

3. A) Add a few custom traits. It should not be too hard to think of some. If it is, however, you'll surely find some ideas in the ideas forum.
B) Raising the roundshield's HP is a... ...bad idea. The roundshield is supposed to be hard to bring down, but not impossible. You might consider giving the roundshield line +10% resistance to impact damage, though (as the lvl1 roundshield has no resistance to impact at all yet afaik). That should already help.

4. Hmmm... I don't really have an idea what to do about this one, but I'd say, one more damage at melee and one more attack at ranged for the line should be okay (not for the line that trades in strikes for damage, though).

5. That surely is a good idea. However, you have to keep them balanced. Maybe it's better to forget this idea for now.

I hope I've been able to help you a bit. And please hurry at creating a 1.2.x-version of the quesicans, I wanna play them! Or maybe it's time to include them into the extended era...?

Thank you very much Clockinator.

I take your suggestions to heart, and I think I'll go with giving the Monk's another point of damage, the pebblemancers might get something but im uncertain yet.

I'll make a few level 4s later, but for now I want them balanced as is.

As to 1.2.x and the EE. I'd like Noyga to have another look, to see if they meet his standards. If this happens I assume that a 1.2.x EE would be available with that.

Be well!
-Qes

[Qes]

DELETED

[Qes]

Update - new version is out.

This is 1.3.7 updated. Please update your version.

Current Version (0.52)
-Changed AI recruitment pattern

- Increased Monk damage to 5-4
- Increased Staff Monk movement to 6
- Increased Blade monk damage to 9-4
- Increased Daiso Monk "empty hand" damage to 5-4
- Increased Master Monk Spirit hands damage to 10-4
- Increased Master Monk speed by 1

::Added traits Clairvoyant, Equiped, Focused, and Spiritual::
-Clairvoyant= +10% Defenses to lightfoot movetype
-Equiped= 2 new attacks, 4-3 melee, and 3-3 ranged
-Focused= +1 melee damage, +1 ranged attacks
-Spiritual= melee damage becomes arcane and damage +1

- Ballista can now also have Equiped and Clairvoyant
- Monk can now have Spiritual
- Scout can now have Equiped and Focused
- Pebblemancer can have Focused, Clairvoyant, and Spiritual


-Qes

[Qes]

Current Version:
v.52A
- Changed "equiped" to only additional melee attack
- Added "huntsman" = additional ranged attack

-Scouts can get huntsmen
-Roundshields can get equiped, huntsmen

[Weeksy]

Those traits are all WAY WAY WAY too game-breaking and/or powerful Just put them up with the other traits you can wind up getting and see what you think...

[Qes]

v.52B
-removed "huntsman" trait
- increased monk cost to 20
- changed monk-line forest defense to 60%, sand,cave,snow,swamp and grassland defense to 50%, shallow water to 30%
- reduced roundshield cost to 16
-increased pebblemancer cost to 18
-increased pebblemancer melee damage by 1, ranged attacks by 1
-increased blademancer melee damage by 1, ranged attacks by 1
-increased gravimancer melee damage by 2, ranged attacks by 2
-increased battlemancer melee damage by 1, ranged attacks by 1
-changed warmancers damage to 10-2 melee, 2-10 ranged

-Qes


Weeksy - having playtested them again - they dont as of yet appear to be game breaking, but I did remove huntsman and added cost in various places. It's undergoing playtesting. The qesicans are still too fragile to make these traits gamebreaking as of yet, but we'll see. These traits are not available to all things, just very specific units, and leveling isn't forgoten in their consideration.