New swamp

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freim
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Post by freim »

Looks good. A couple more variants of the trunk special would be nice.
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zookeeper
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Post by zookeeper »

zookeeper wrote:
grzywacz wrote:Is it possible to make the cutoff line (the one at which unit sinks) less straight? :?:
Funnily enough, I tried it a few days back. You can do it, but units which especially wide might end up looking a bit funny. Not necessarily any more funny than they do now though. All you need is to edit the misc/ellipse-top and misc/ellipse-bottom images (top gets drawn behind the unit and bottom in front of the unit, when submerging).
I'll take this back, it doesn't seem like those ellipse images have anything to do with it after all (remembering the option of turning them off made me realize that).

I don't think we can right now have any terrain be drawn on top of units. At some point it was so (so that castles for example overlapped the units "realistically"), but apparently it got changed. I'm not very good with terrain graphics WML though, so I might possibly be wrong on this.
mog
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Post by mog »

Thank you for the feedback :)

I disabled the circles for exactly the reason, that you can see the sunken effect. So here is a more "realistic" shot:
Image

And here a larger patch of swamp with several transitions (may look pixelized because I reduced the colours):

Image

I added some variations and improved the transitions to terrains like castels an mountains/hills.

The overgrown look of the swamp castle is deliberate, but could be removed. There will also be plants inside the castle.

@Sapient: I quite like the current transitions to grassland/dirt (one might argue about the road - although it has a nice "abandoned road swallowed by swamp"-look). Swamps usually don't have a distinct border and I don't know how to draw one, really.

Apart from the swamp castle, the only thing to do is some some more variations (they're quite easy to make), then I'll post the files here.
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Sapient
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Post by Sapient »

I drew a foamy green swamp border one time while I was messing around in PaintshopPro that looked really cool. Unfortunately I didn't save the file, and since then my efforts to duplicate it have failed horribly. :?

I see you added some flower variations. They look nice. :)
http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/User:Sapient... "Looks like your skills saved us again. Uh, well at least, they saved Soarin's apple pie."
mog
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Post by mog »

Does anyone know why the following WML results in a distribution of approximately:
90% reed1
7% reed2
3% reed3 ?

{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 33 reed1-small}
{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 50 reed2-small}
{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 100 reed3-small}
{FORESTADJ q !q 33 reed1-small}
{FORESTADJ q !q 50 reed2-small}
{FORESTADJ q !q 100 reed3-small}

Is there something I misunderstood about the probability-property or is it a bug?

[edit]
Okay, I found the reason. Because of the rotations=n,ne,se,s,sw,nw, it will try to match up to six times (if all directions match) which results in an effective probability of 1-(1-p)^n.
Is this by design or a bug? Because it makes it difficult to have a even distribution of variations, if the number of possible matches varies (e.g. if there are six mountains around a swamp, the distribution is different than when there are two mountains adjactent to it).
[/edit]
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freim
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Post by freim »

mog wrote: [edit]
Okay, I found the reason. Because of the rotations=n,ne,se,s,sw,nw, it will try to match up to six times (if all directions match) which results in an effective probability of 1-(1-p)^n.
Is this by design or a bug? Because it makes it difficult to have a even distribution of variations, if the number of possible matches varies (e.g. if there are six mountains around a swamp, the distribution is different than when there are two mountains adjactent to it).
[/edit]
So thats the reason why I've always felt that the distribution have been totally wack... :shock: I would like this behavior changed.

Your latest screenshot looks very nice with the new variations. I like the overgrown ruin.
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Post by Darth Fool »

mog wrote: [edit]
Okay, I found the reason. Because of the rotations=n,ne,se,s,sw,nw, it will try to match up to six times (if all directions match) which results in an effective probability of 1-(1-p)^n.
Is this by design or a bug?
[/edit]
I would call it a bug. Please file a bug report at gna: https://gna.org/bugs/?group=wesnoth
If luck is with me and I actually ge a free weekend this next weekend, I might even get to fixing it. Of course, given recent history, I wouldn't bet on it, but if you file the bug report, it won't be forgotten.
mog
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Post by mog »

Ok, submitted bug as https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?7274

I've now completed the new swamp and added a village variation (again: reduced colors):
Image

The tiles are here: http://yavin.mogsoft.de/~mog/wesnoth/swamp-tiles.tar.gz
A diff (against trunk) for the WMLs is here: http://yavin.mogsoft.de/~mog/wesnoth/swamp.diff


Also, I got a suggestion via PM (from tsr) to reduce the submerge-effect of units. The left (and current) value is 0.4 the right one 0.3 (without teamcolor, to make the effect more visible). I like both, so it's up to you.
ImageImage
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grzywacz
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Post by grzywacz »

I like the second better, as I'd rather expect units to sink into the mud no deeper than knees. :idea:
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Jetrel
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Post by Jetrel »

grzywacz wrote:I like the second better, as I'd rather expect units to sink into the mud no deeper than knees. :idea:
Yeah, I think the second one would work better.

Thanks a ton for making these, though - these tiles are incredible. :D
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Post by Darth Fool »

mog wrote:Ok, submitted bug as https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?7274
Excellent. I have assigned the bug to myself, for now. Do you (or anyone else) have a pathologically designed map where it is clear that this effect is happening.
Preferably the map should be as simple as possible, maybe with only two terrains + shroud. I imagine it might just be three columns wide, 1 terrain surrounded by the other one:

Code: Select all

xxx
xyx
xxx
xyx
xxx                    
...etc...
but which terrain to use? This would be helpful in verifying that any fix actually does work.
freim
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Post by freim »

Commited to trunk and 1.2 branch.
mog
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Post by mog »

Oops... I just noticed that the tar.gz-file was not up-to-date (this seems to happen to me quite often...). Please remove the village-swampwater-small.png from svn and commit http://yavin.mogsoft.de/~mog/wesnoth/vi ... water2.png instead.

@Darth Fool: Well, I adjusted the probabilities in the terrain-graphics.cfg, so that the problem would not be too noticable. But if you change the probabilities in the lines

Code: Select all

{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 8 reed1-small}
{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 13 reed2-small}
{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 21 reed3-small}
{FORESTADJ Yw CnQoKNhaHAmb& 100 reed4-small}
to 25, 33, 50 ,100 the problem should be evident with single swamp tiles surrounded by mountains/castles/hills (The resulting Distribution will be about 82%, 16%, 2% 0%).
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freim
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Post by freim »

mog wrote:Oops... I just noticed that the tar.gz-file was not up-to-date (this seems to happen to me quite often...). Please remove the village-swampwater-small.png from svn and commit http://yavin.mogsoft.de/~mog/wesnoth/vi ... water2.png instead.
Done
Neoriceisgood
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Post by Neoriceisgood »

What, Swamps that actually -look- like swamps?

What madness is this?
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