World Conquest II

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jb
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by jb » October 17th, 2019, 9:37 pm


You are wrong, you can try to deinstall your copy of wcII in your remove addons dialog and try to join any wcII game in the lobby. You will get the 'missing addon wcII, do you want to install it's dialog independent on whether it used the cystom terrain mod or not.
I will try when I get home. This was the original intention - to keep it as user friendly as possible. And I am currently able to join 'normal' WC games even though i'm installed a custom version.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:57 pm
None of these units are custom, however they aren't core either (not all of them).
I think gfgtdf will decide wether it will stay core content or not,
Same as above, the original intention was to keep the game as user friendly as possible. Tek put so much work and polish into making it so. One of the reasons it is so popular (other than being really fun) is that it is easily accessible to new players.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:57 pm
My suggestions does not speak of complete removal of the fish hero. It only sais that fish heros will drop only on water/swamp/"wet" tiles
That is a really neat idea. Hope you can pull it off.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:57 pm
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that you playing your own version of WC II so for you it would be good to maintain it core only so you wouldn't have to share it with everyone everytime you want to play with some new. But since you are playing your own version anyway, you wouldn't care that much over the state of the official WC II.
It's true. I am currently still testing a custom version made by ezysquire (it's very avant garde lolol). But I love all versions! :)

I slightly worry about the trajectory if things become more and more custom with more and more focus on hardcore players. Me, as a player, love the ideas of great custom content. Great replay value. And, so far. I think everyone has done a really great job. But the original spirit could quickly get derailed if WCII becomes too exclusive. Just a consideration.

cheers
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ghype
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by ghype » October 18th, 2019, 12:14 am

jb wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 9:37 pm
I slightly worry about the trajectory if things become more and more custom with more and more focus on hardcore players. But the original spirit could quickly get derailed if WCII becomes too exclusive.
I never intend to do that as Alien Era is still a thing. Problem is that those who don't know what wml is never come to think on how to use custom eras. As far my knowledge goes, it would be very time consuming to make Alien Era available as an option in the game menu. Or is it not?

If it is, maybe it is considerable to maintain two version where one is default and the other is Alien Era only?

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SatHyre
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Re: Response to Sathyre

Post by SatHyre » October 18th, 2019, 7:06 am

hi,
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:11 pm
So your suggestions are:
- Dunefolk & Dwarves
- Dunefolk & Northeners
- Dunefolk & Undead ?
yes.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:11 pm
Well, adding content for more experienced players is the goal of this update. New players will pick their favourite faction instead of going random. If some of the new alliances turn out to be "hard" then it's not a problem. Balance can be tweaked by changing the unit pairs.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:11 pm
The Cult at the moment is the "easiest" alliance as it gives you +8 healer as recruitable. Reason for removing Herbalist is that not only does is not fit in the alliance, but it no longer will be +8 heal but +4 heal/regen instead, which will not be that beneficial for that alliance. Other alliances have also no starting healers. If you require a healer on scenario 1 than you either try your luck with a the item list or the heros. If you are unlucky than you have to adjust your play-style according to that.
some alliances got unpaired, Cult got an healer +8, i think this was done because some balances are needed : to make some alliance not to be very weak or hard to play. now, more good players play WC II. you can change the pair, remove the healer for Cult and let these players test and make an opinion about the changement.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:11 pm
well, thats the beauty. Even some alliances are considered stronger and some easier, it really doesnt matter because everyone has other factions they can play the best.
if some alliances are weak, there is a risk that players will never pick them. diversity is the key to make the game interesting.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:11 pm
No, there will never be 21 factions.
21 with the new alliances : 9 now + 6 from the new alliances (dwarves and northeners, drakes and loyalists, ...) + 6 with dunefolks.
just 12 with 3 new dunefolks alliances listed at begining of this topic.
ghype wrote:
October 17th, 2019, 8:11 pm
Well, for the goblin I will create a new (but very similar) lv2 - if we will not stay with core content only.
If we do stay with core content only, it is maybe a better idea to give both of them unique AMLA? Maybe even AMLA you can pick so you can costumize them? Just like the Dust Devil in UtbS or Konrad/Haldric in their campaigns.
They will stay lv1 but get stronger with every lv up. What do you think of that?
in ageless era, there is an unit with just one level. but each time he reach his AMLA, you can costumize him : +1 mp, or +hp, or +1 damage, or change his attack from cold to fire, and fire to cold next AMLA. of course, his AMLA increases 10% each time if i remember. i love this idea. if it's the same about the dust devil, YES.
by the way, why dont be that the default for all units in wesnoth ?

to summarize. and as jb statued, let's make the changement gradually. for me :
- add Dunefolk as enemy, AND change goblin and walking corpse.
- add the 3 Dunefolk alliances.
- tweak the existing alliances, OR add new items, OR add new heroes.
- add new alliances.

gfgtdf
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by gfgtdf » October 18th, 2019, 5:42 pm

ghype wrote:
October 18th, 2019, 12:14 am

I never intend to do that as Alien Era is still a thing. Problem is that those who don't know what wml is never come to think on how to use custom eras. As far my knowledge goes, it would be very time consuming to make Alien Era available as an option in the game menu. Or is it not?
The current version of the 1.14 server (0.7.3 iirc) has alienera enabled by default so you can start WCII with any era, but I only did that so see how people like it or not. I saw some games that used default era "accidently" that ist because player didn't notice that the WCII era exists so I might change it back to block other eras by default
Scenario with Robots SP scenario (1.11/1.12), allows you to build your units with components, PYR No preperation turn 1.12 mp-mod that allows you to select your units immideately after the game begins.

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Krogen
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by Krogen » October 23rd, 2019, 1:11 am

Has anyone ever considered adding level 4s as enemies to the last scenario on Nightmare? An Armageddon Drake or an Elvish Sylph coming your way would be something to see and... quite epic, a worthy showdown. Like, one or two sides could send a level 4 instead of two level 3s or something like that.
"A lion doesn't concern himself with the opinions of the sheep." - Tywin Lannister

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ghype
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by ghype » October 23rd, 2019, 8:28 am

If anything, they could be recruited 2 from each side on last mapt. Problem is, that this would only work if the alliances have lv4 enabled.

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Krogen
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by Krogen » October 23rd, 2019, 10:07 pm

I can't imagine it'd be too hard to make them recruit level 4s that can actually advance in-game. (Grand Marshal, Great Mage, Elvish Sylph) The other ones might be a different story. (Ancient Lich, Dwarvish Arcanister, Armageddon Drake)
There are already Great Trolls, so they wouldn't be that much stronger.
Also, just for fun think about this: Imagine the player's shock if a Skeletal Dragon appeared. Or a Yeti, lol.
"A lion doesn't concern himself with the opinions of the sheep." - Tywin Lannister

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ghype
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by ghype » October 24th, 2019, 4:01 am

Krogen wrote:
October 23rd, 2019, 10:07 pm
Imagine the player's shock if a Skeletal Dragon appeared. Or a Yeti, lol.
well, the strongest reason why not to get them into the game is that Skeletal Dragon for example is not animated at all (neither is fire dragon).

at some moment i was thinking, what it would be like to add an AI that recruits only monster, basically add an Monster Alliance only for AI. I however didn't liked the idea of it recruiting fire spirits and other annoying lv0 and lv1 monsters on lower maps. It could derail into something WC is not supposed to be.

But adding an Monster Alliance only for AI using only high level monsters only on last map. That could be interesting. This would require some balancing though.

millionbwoy
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by millionbwoy » October 25th, 2019, 1:01 am

Hoho,
thanks for solving bugs and keeping wc2 updated!
It's the only mode I like playing since I was on 1.12 version, I played a lot and I wanna keep doing that. Unfortunately I never played the original wc but I really wanna try another challenge like a new map6 (older players told me there were originally 6 maps) or something harder than nightmare. I read the discussion and personally I think that getting a fish hero from the point is [censored] and useless but it's better leave that because I like the random factor and I think that to adapt to the situation is a skill.
Thanks for your work!

Pagawan
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Re: World Conquest II

Post by Pagawan » October 27th, 2019, 12:05 pm

My suggestion on handling factions with no regeneration units or low level healers (herbalist, shammy or augur) would be to avail them or the "Heals 8 Cures" item in their choice inventory. This ensures some balance especially if in map1; players have had no chance to raise a healer and suddenly facing orc/undead (the super poisoners) combo or otherwise...
I would also suggest looking at the Movement Training. It goes up only 2 levels and doesn't give much (Level 1; 52% chance for +1mp . Level 2 and max; ?% Movement defense & 1% Charging option and +22% mps) maybe up the percentage in Level 1 to about 60% and improve the other 2 (especially charging options) in max level. I can tell you for a fact I use it all the time but I can't remember when I last saw charging option active.

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