World Conquest II

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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » May 2nd, 2015, 3:53 pm

@pe_em: Could you provide save of last turn of 1st scenario wich leaded to bug? I have inspected save and have almost no variables, wich in theory would have made impossible play scenario1 :hmm: (may be is a save game from an observer?)

Edit: Thinking about it, that game was saved from obsever status looks only reasonable explanation. There is no way my code deleted all scenario variables, so I guess you suffered a BfW engine bug (were you playing a prior version to 1.12.2? as far as I know this bug should not happen in 1.12.2).

@Rigor: Thanks for coments, however I dont think we can play soon, I have limited myself to just one active game to have some free time... for my life, and dont become burnt about WC.
Be aware English is not my first language and I could have explained bad myself using wrong or just invented words.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby pe_em » May 2nd, 2015, 7:46 pm

I was playing on 1.12.2. But maybe wingsfalcon didn't. I'll send you a 1st scenario replay tommorow, because now I'm on tablet.
It was actually an observer replay, because I left the game and came again to try to get the control of 2nd side. However, the host couldn't give it me.

And one suggestion: don't you think that the 'nightmare' level isn't too easy? Well, the first scenario was very easy. :lol: But as I read a fragment of the first post I think the next ones aren't.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » May 3rd, 2015, 8:32 am

pe_em wrote:It was actually an observer replay, because I left the game and came again to try to get the control of 2nd side. However, the host couldn't give it me.
That was probably source of bug. As I told you, a game without variables can only happens if BfW engine dont load them for the game saver (but is difficult to me be sure about cause, as I dont know BfW engine code. I detected a bug for observers prior to 1.12.2 but who knows if bug can be trigged in other ways)

pe_em wrote:And one suggestion: don't you think that the 'nightmare' level isn't too easy? Well, the first scenario was very easy. :lol: But as I read a fragment of the first post I think the next ones aren't.
If any group of 3 players, claim they can beat WC II in level Nightmare without save-reloads for RNG, 10 times in a row of ten tries, then I will accept difficulty is bad designed... however doesnt look anyone claimed such thing yet ;)
Be aware English is not my first language and I could have explained bad myself using wrong or just invented words.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby pe_em » May 3rd, 2015, 11:42 am

doesnt look anyone claimed such thing yet ;)

Well, I'm a person who firstly says something, then thinks about it :mrgreen: But I don't think this level is hard enough, however.

I have only a replay.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » May 3rd, 2015, 6:04 pm

pe_em wrote:But I don't think this level is hard enough, however.


World Conquest design is about replayability. Most of BfW campaigns feature a kinda puzzle challenge: as they have static maps with staic settings for enemies, they can feture extremly hard sceneraios. As player probably wont replay many times scenario once beated, and players reload scenario instead start campaign again when they are defeated, a higher level of fustration can be tolerated.

World Conqest II dont try to feature "very hard scenarios", instead feature a "very hard campaign". For this propose, scenarios can not be "a Nightmare by themselves". If players had a 10% chance of victory for every one of 5 scenarios, they would have a total 0.0001% chance of Campaign victory. My target in difficulty design is that very skilled players have about 50% victory rate playing Campaign in Nightmare without save-reloads (if you lost scenario, you lost campaign). if you also consider that random generation have variances in difficulty, you should understand that it has no sense judge campaign difficulty by playing just 1 scenario.

World Conquest II difficulty should be judged in base a serie of about 10 campaigns played without save-reloads.
Be aware English is not my first language and I could have explained bad myself using wrong or just invented words.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby major_tom » May 9th, 2015, 8:01 am

Hi tekelili,

we love to play your great add-on on LAN partys.

Unfortunately we do have a problem advancing from the 2nd to the 3rd scenario - as we startet playing we where all on wesnoth 1.2.1 and WC II era 6.2 - then we had an update to wesnot 1.2.2 and the included WC II era was 6.4.

the geame mentioned that it could not find the 6.2 era - so i opened the save game and edited the era to 6.4 and that message was gone away. but instead now the message after finishing the 2nd scenario is: "mandatory WML child missing yet untested for."

i tried to downgrade WC II to 6.3.3 with the unmodified save game as mentioned on the first page of this thread but that did not help and was quit by the same WML message.

can you find the problem we have by looking into the save game?
we really want to play ahead instead of starting a new game so we would be very glad if that would be possible.

==================================
One other thing we discovered:

when playing in planning mode, the most of the time a message appears that the user x sent illegal whiteboeard data that is ignored. mostly when executing the plans, including Recruiting. we solved this by not playing in planning mode, which is a bit of a downgrade of the game.

==================================

i post you one unmodified save game and one modified - neither work

king regards,
tom
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » May 9th, 2015, 10:05 am

@major_tom: I removed WC II folder from my add on folder, and replaced it with version 0.6.3.3 (you can download it from 1st post in this thread): I loaded one of your saves (not sure wich one), killed enemy boss, and got a transition to next scenario with no errors. Let me know if you are unable to reproduce these steps, the only factor could affect was I was in local game, so try first to transition in local game before test in multiplayer server.
Be aware English is not my first language and I could have explained bad myself using wrong or just invented words.
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Transition to map 5 bug

Postby harl » May 11th, 2015, 4:40 pm

Hi tekelili.

In my 2p game with SatHyre we are experiencing a horrible transition to map 5 bug.

On map 5 we have been assigned new random factions, new (non heroic) kings stand in our keeps and our original leaders have been pushed to one side. The recruit list remains as was but units now do not cycle as recruit list does not fit with new faction. One (each) of our heroes has been assigned the new name "20 gold".

I dont try to transition to map 5 all that often but this has never happened to me before.

This is a standard 2 player nightmare game that has been played normally and has not been messed about with in any way. Wesnoth version 1.12.2 and the latest release of wcII.

I have had other players save the game and host and the bug still occurs.

Attached is the save of the game before transition. I am almost certain we will win this game so I would really like to be able to play it without this weird bug. If you could make that happen it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby major_tom » May 11th, 2015, 7:46 pm

tekelili wrote:@major_tom: I removed WC II folder from my add on folder, and replaced it with version 0.6.3.3 (you can download it from 1st post in this thread): I loaded one of your saves (not sure wich one), killed enemy boss, and got a transition to next scenario with no errors. Let me know if you are unable to reproduce these steps, the only factor could affect was I was in local game, so try first to transition in local game before test in multiplayer server.


thank you, it worked out to advance to the next level as a lokal game with 6.3.3 installed.
i will test it on the server the next time the players will meet.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » May 12th, 2015, 6:52 pm

@harl: I have inspected savegame after transition, and problem is that [event] for swap pairs on recruit is not beign loaded. Load that event is resposability of [era] tag, so I have no clue how find out why is this happening by inspecting save. Other [era] events (as "tell me how my recruit works") are beign loaded correctly :?

What I can offer you is a file of last scenario hacked to include that event, I attach file. (it must be placed in scenerios folder)

I didnt spoted any bug with leaders after scenario transition. I used for my test version 0.6.4 because is what objectives says game is using, so I suspect you suffering this bug is due to use an upgraded one. You can download 0.6.4 from 1st post of this thread.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby harl » May 13th, 2015, 12:10 am

Thanks tekelili!

I really thought that this game was started after I downloaded the latest wcII addon but it turns out I was wrong about that, sorry. :oops:

Reverting to version 0.6.4 seems to entirely resolve the issues we were having on transition to map 5, at least during my short test as a local multiplayer game. I have downloaded your hacked scenario file in case we experience problems when we try to play the game on the multiplayer server.

I will pay more attention to which version I was using when my saved games were started in future as I seem to have quite a mix of version 0.6.4 and 0.6.4.1 saves.

Thanks again!!! Your intervention and resolution of this problem is greatly appreciated and the support that you provide for your players is excellent. :D
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby major_tom » May 13th, 2015, 7:35 pm

We are now playing the 3rd scenario. thanks a lot!
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » June 1st, 2015, 6:43 pm

Version 0.6.4.2 uploaded

It has not important changes, but as I broke compatibility lot of times in past, I wanted advise compatibility is not broken this time :)
Even more, I am now storing version in wich a game is created inside a variable. This means I expect be able to deal with future incompatibilities warning user. I also think I have finished to reconfiguring how data are loaded, and also finished "clean up work" to make code redeable.

From now users should expect no compatibility problems upgrading version if no post from me warning about it :D

About new version, main change is that Goblin Spearman and Walking Corpse heroes trait "legendary" has been changed to allow them a special level 2 advancement to Goblin Pillager and Chocobone. They are still low class heroes, but now not so ridiculous weak. I also think it improves flavor without disrupt balance.
Be aware English is not my first language and I could have explained bad myself using wrong or just invented words.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby Xara » June 5th, 2015, 6:02 am

I turned on the "Allow Alien Era" config, but then the sides frequently start on the same keep.
Remember to sleep early, guys.
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Re: World Conquest II

Postby tekelili » June 5th, 2015, 8:31 am

Xara wrote:I turned on the "Allow Alien Era" config, but then the sides frequently start on the same keep.

Thanks for report it. I am trying to reproduce it playing with Default Era, but all looks to work well. What steps do you think lead to bug?

Edit: When reporting bugs, it helps me a lot know WC II version used, BfW version used and, if talking about a saved game, if any version was upgraded since game creation. When dealing with bugs about side placement, number of players mode used can also be meaningfull.
Be aware English is not my first language and I could have explained bad myself using wrong or just invented words.
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