World Conquest II

[tekelili]

As I changed code to do things in a cleaner way and used some new tags, I had no intended "translate" changes developed for BfW 1.11 to 1.10 version. But as it looks BfW 1.12 can take a little longer to come than I expected, I have decided include faction changes, as they are very important for gameplay and not very troublesome to "translate".

Uploaded version 0.5.3 to Bfw 1.10 add on server (changes to Militia, Cult and Hand factions)

Anyway I hope we can enjoy BfW 1.12 soon, there WC II has 4 new maps, corrected carryover rules (hopefully will fix 1p and 2p modes) and several little interface improvements

Edit: I have deleted tranaslated version from 1.10 addon server. It was a little outdated and I am not going to maintain it because I found a better way to manage translation problem in 1.12 (it is integrated as config option without almost no code duplicity at all).

[ellyk]

Hi tekelili,
I'm playing on the dev wesnoth and, I think I bumped into a bug?
I'm on second map, and of course, I have units to recall. I always recall my level 2 units after recruiting new ones, to limit the upkeep at first...

I have 4 units to recall and 89 gold to spend, so 4*20= 80, I have enough gold.
But, each times I recall, the amount of gold diminishes by 11 and once the recall is done, it's back normal.
From 89 gold, it goes to 78, and when the recall is done, it's back to 69 gold. 89-69=20, ok, it's normal..
Now, after 3 recalls, my gold is 29, it goes to 18 during the recall, a message comes up saying "you must have at least 20 gold to recall that unit". After the message is gone, I still have 29 gold left.

I checked on the 1.10 version, and the same happens. Could it be a side effect of the code to recall for 'price of unit'+3 you integrated?
I'll just reload and wait one turn to have largely enough gold.

[Battlecruiser_Venca]

isn't there a feature "force recall" to override that thing?

[ellyk]

Really? I haven't seen anything like that. Could you explain a bit more what did you mean, please?


Nevermind, after taking a look over the whole changelog... I found this

0.5.2.4
- Redefined recall code for better perfomance and to do unneccessary Force-Recall option (removed)

I'm not sure what tekelili means, but I understand that at some point he coded a 'force-recall option' and he finally removed it, changing the code of recalls directly...
But, because I'm really bad at coding, I can't really guess what he was talking about in the changelog.
Anyway, thanks for your answer.

[tekelili]

Hi tekelili,
I'm playing on the dev wesnoth and, I think I bumped into a bug?
I'm on second map, and of course, I have units to recall. I always recall my level 2 units after recruiting new ones, to limit the upkeep at first...

I have 4 units to recall and 89 gold to spend, so 4*20= 80, I have enough gold.
But, each times I recall, the amount of gold diminishes by 11 and once the recall is done, it's back normal.
From 89 gold, it goes to 78, and when the recall is done, it's back to 69 gold. 89-69=20, ok, it's normal..
Now, after 3 recalls, my gold is 29, it goes to 18 during the recall, a message comes up saying "you must have at least 20 gold to recall that unit". After the message is gone, I still have 29 gold left.

I checked on the 1.10 version, and the same happens. Could it be a side effect of the code to recall for 'price of unit'+3 you integrated?
I'll just reload and wait one turn to have largely enough gold.

Hi ellyk and thanks for bug report. I have tried to reproduce bug you described, but I got intended behavior (I could recall a shaman at map 2 having only 18 gold and also a Dark Sorcerer having 28 gold). As I am using debug to test, and not using multiplayer server, I can not be really sure "all is working fine".

If you were using last WC II version (update if not), post a replay where I can reproduce it and will try figre out what is working wrong

And yea, force recall option was the first way to allow recall under 20 gold. I finally removed it to make gameplay more simple for user. WC II has now recall cost "secretly setted" to 11 gold and after recall is done the right cost is applied. I think this is more comfortable for players than now dont have to care about extra options for recall. When players try to recall units without having enougth gold, unit is shown for a moment, but then is inmediatly sent back to recall list, gold stays the same before recall try, and player is advised about not having enougth gold to recall that unit.

[ellyk]

Ok, I have just made a save with wesnoth 1.11.16 and the newest version of your campaign. You just need to recall the fighter.

[tekelili]

Ok, I have just made a save with wesnoth 1.11.16 and the newest version of your campaign. You just need to recall the fighter.

Thanks a lot, I finally understood bug. It looks like me using debug->gold command was cause of not detecting it before (I will do some test to check if I should do a report to gna).

I am a little busy right now, but will upload a version with bug fixed soon .

EDIT: Sorry for take a long time, I had my mind totally focused in other issues. I have uploaded new versions (for BfW 1.10 and 1.11) with the bug hopefully fixed. As it looks debug command can sometimes cheat me, let me know if something is still working wrong.

[Glowing Fish]

One thing I've noticed from watching a lot of WC games is that the AI scouts and takes villages very inefficiently. This is something that the players would usually not notice, since most of the enemies first few turns of recruiting are done behind the fog of war.

The AI usually assigns the first turn of recruits, sometimes the first two, to get villages. The problem with this is that these are usually its strongest units, and also not its fastest units. I have seen Dwarf Lords, Iron Maulers, Dark Sorcerers and the like, recruited on the first turn, sent out to get swamp or water villages. This can take three turns, and then another three turns for them to get back to the start. By that time, the later recruits, which are lower-level units, have already made contact with the enemy, and usually been defeated. Usually by the time the Level 3 units make it to the player position, the battle has already been turned.

So, in other words, by using non-scout units to scout, the AI is unable to concentrate its forces.

Would it make more sense to give the AI a first turn recruit of scouting units?

[tekelili]

@Glowing Fish: You are right in your analysis of AI behavior, I also noticed it and did some tries to fix it without succes

I tried force AI to recall first all level 2 and then start to recall all level 3 but it showed not to be a good fix: It was very troublesome to code because with 6 difficulties and 1-3 players modes AI has 18 possible starting gold and quite complex avoid AI run out of money with level 3 recalls still in list. I also noticed that game effect was players had more turns to prepare and place their army, leading to a less challenge campaign.

In general, I withdraw from try to fix AI behavior for 2 reasons: I am not skilled enougth to do it and I guess it would create more problems than would sove. A more clever AI would umbalance campaign and I would have to start test/balance process from zero. And in the end, it is debatable it would improve gameplay, may be current AI status "very stupid-lot of units" is the most enjoyable scenario

edit: However, I added time ago a small fix to classic WC about this issue. In WC II, AI sides always recruit a level 1 unit every turn before start recalling, trying to "free" a strong unit from scout tasks.

[tekelili]

Versions 0.5.3.2 for BfW 1.10 and 0.5.7 for BfW 1.11 uploaded

Main reason for version is buff The Cult. I realized the problems this faction are so big, that trying to have it balanced "being loyal to every unit a pair" is impossible task. They are the faction with worst infantry and movility, so need be more cost effecient in their recruits. I have "broken two pairs", and now faction is able to spam mage, dark adept, ghoul and horseman.

The Guild has a small change in its recruit. I think is a small buff, but I must confess is done more for "flavor reasons".

[Paulomat4]

Hey,
I think I found 2 bugs:

1. If you go into the WCopedia (right-click menu)you can't undo the move you made before. Adding [allow_undo] should solve this.

2. Somehow since the third scenario at the beginning of each turn, I get a save_game failed error message. I am also unable to save manually. The only thing that could have affected this was the leader of the third side who was killed in the scenario before. (I had a replacement leader)

Also a suggestion: I understand why you make enemy leaders stay in their keep, to keep them from rushing out. But how about changing the behaviour by making them only stay in their castle? so they could at least move a bit. The current situation is quite easy to exploit.

[tekelili]

Hey,
I think I found 2 bugs:

Thanks for bug reporting

I have added allow_undo to all menu items but preset_advacement (doesnt look to work there) in the future version.

The problem you described to be impossible save is quite weird. I tested promote a comander and advance scenario and could save withouth problems. As obviusly you wont be able to provide a save when that problem happens and in theory it should be impossible cause such behavior from wml (if I am correct)... we are here really in darkness If it happens again to you, try to imagine any pattern and let me know it.

[Paulomat4]

I have added allow_undo to all menu items but preset_advacement (doesnt look to work there) in the future version.

Wonderful

The problem you described to be impossible save is quite weird. I tested promote a comander and advance scenario and could save withouth problems. As obviusly you wont be able to provide a save when that problem happens and in theory it should be impossible cause such behavior from wml (if I am correct)... we are here really in darkness If it happens again to you, try to imagine any pattern and let me know it.

Well, i played som LOTI after that and got the same problem here. So it doesn't seem to be related to any add-on. It just occured for the first time when playing WC tek. sorry for alerting you.

[tekelili]

Version 0.5.8 uploaded in BfW 1.12 add on server

It includes wich will be probably last faction added to WC II: The Empire

Empire recruit:

Khalifate units were added to bonus points heroes (none with extra yet, under test)

This faction is totally untested and probably I wont start test until stable version release, but I was confident with experience earned testing for a year WCII and think is quite probable they are ok.

Edit:

is quite probable they are ok.

It took me just one game playing them to realize how wrong I was. Khalifate unirs are very weak in WC amd gona be a real challenge become them a decent faction. Empire was buffed in 0.5.8.4 with dark adept as pair of hakim. Test in progress.

Edit2: My first try to create a faction with Khalifate units was a mess; they have changed a lot since I played them and now I realize some of their problems in WC. Faction recruit has been totally redefined, hoping next tests give better feeling

[tekelili]

Version 0.6 uploaded on 1.12 add on server.

A resume of improves from 0.5
- The weakest factions: Gang, Cult, Hand and Guild have been improved and I am 95% happy about them right now (test will say if I am right)
- Menus finally polished and Wocopedia more complete. Option to inspect items on ground.
- Improved compatibility, generating hero list for other eras and allowing use WC II era in other scenarios. Supported change of side color to any one.
- Huge improvement to map pool, 9 new maps added to Classic WC ones. (edit: 10 from v0.6.0.1)
- Modes for 1p and 2p looks now more reasonable balanced, and I consider them beta version now.

A special note about The Empire (faction with Kalifate units): Khalifate units have proven be very bad in WC, and I discovered that all strength of faction comes from default units used as pairs. Their current status is probably all "buff" I am willing to give. If test proves they can not manage at decent level in WC II, then I will remove faction (until future changes to Khalifate improve their units).