Conquest Minus

Discussion of all aspects of multiplayer development: unit balancing, map development, server development, and so forth.

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SlowThinker
Posts: 876
Joined: November 28th, 2008, 6:18 pm

for PlayerX

Post by SlowThinker » October 5th, 2013, 11:21 pm

This is a notice especially for PlayerX, who was considering he would create a campaign-style scenario(s) for Conquest Minus.

Now Conquest Minus is much more ready for such a type of a scenario than earlier, because now scenarios can overwrite the code of the Minus core.
The code of these scenarios can explain it:
  • 1_test_strength_1.cfg shows how to change basic behaviours of the game
  • gabrithia.cfg shows how to add new units
I work on Conquest Minus • I use DFoolWide, Retro Terrain Package and the add-on 'High Contrast Water'
I moved to Nosebane's corner (Doc Paterson's signature); I am spending my time there, so PM me if I don't answer your post in forums

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Blop
Posts: 76
Joined: May 22nd, 2011, 6:49 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by Blop » November 26th, 2013, 12:18 pm

I have a note about the algorithm that places players:

I'm not exactly sure how it works, but it appears to me that the first player spawns on specific positions all the time.
I suggest that positions are shuffled after the placing process (without changing the teams). I guess that's possible.

Regards, Blop

SlowThinker
Posts: 876
Joined: November 28th, 2008, 6:18 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by SlowThinker » November 26th, 2013, 5:31 pm

Blop,
a) maybe the issue is a continuation of this bug:
look at this post (skip the part about OOS) and the subsequent one.
(So far I got no report whether the patch in 3.1.3 worked or not)

b) or it is another bug.

-------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is I cannot reproduce the bug, because I was never affected.
1) I would like to know about more detailed test results (because I still think you might be mistaken)
2) I can create a special version of Conquest Minus, that will serve for debugging purposes of this bug. Then you and other affected players must run tests with that Conquest Minus version and report results here.

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Blop
Posts: 76
Joined: May 22nd, 2011, 6:49 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by Blop » December 2nd, 2013, 4:10 pm

I've tested a bit and could not reproduce what I was getting earlier.
You're probably right; it was just a statistical coincidence.

Conscience
Posts: 10
Joined: April 24th, 2009, 11:33 am

Tournament or ladder?

Post by Conscience » December 19th, 2013, 4:51 pm

SlowThinker has said about my tournament, that you can see at http://bracketcloud.com/tournament/2132, that it would be better to use a ladder for our games. I agree a ladder would be very interesting but where to do that?

ST has said to go to http://wesnoth.gamingladder.info/. But can we host there a ladder just for Conquest minus games?

SlowThinker
Posts: 876
Joined: November 28th, 2008, 6:18 pm

Ladder

Post by SlowThinker » December 21st, 2013, 4:44 pm

obsolete
the answer is hidden in "Conquestopedia / How can I help?" :

we need a server that will run the 'classic Wesnoth ladder' software:
conquest minus ladder

('ladder8' would require much more work)
Things started to move on:
Conquest Minus Ladder (preparatory works)
I work on Conquest Minus • I use DFoolWide, Retro Terrain Package and the add-on 'High Contrast Water'
I moved to Nosebane's corner (Doc Paterson's signature); I am spending my time there, so PM me if I don't answer your post in forums

SlowThinker
Posts: 876
Joined: November 28th, 2008, 6:18 pm

Teleports

Post by SlowThinker » January 22nd, 2014, 9:52 pm

Edit1: see the meledestus' idea
Edit2: i attached a new beta version of Conquest Minus with a new teleport system so that you can test it

In the next version I plan serious changes in the mechanics of teleports.
Please complain:
a system that shall be implemented
Players should not be confused by the changes because there will also be a visual change: a unit that has just been teleported shows a floating text.

(new!) A player may decide whether
- his unit will stop on a teleport hex
- his unit can teleport
This is controlled by the Teleport Mode, which also controls whether a map will scroll towards the destination hex. Players can right-click on any teleport in order to change the Teleport Mode.

(new!) Also any unit (0 movepoints is sufficient) that stands on a teleport can be teleported directly by right-clicking on the teleport.

If the destination hex is occupied...
If the destination hex is occupied then the unit will be teleported to an alternative hex. These rules apply (the rules are ordered by their priority):
1) occupied hexes, villages (new!) and impassable terrain are excluded.
(No other terrain limitations (new!) : the terrain needn't be accessible for the unit, and so for example a ship can teleport into land) I am hesitating about this point
2) preferred hexes are adjacent hexes (radius=1), only then adjacent hexes of adjacent hexes (radius=2) and so on
3) a hex with lowest coordinates is preferred (what is "lowest coordinates"? Transform coordinates into one decimal number, e.g. x=8 y=26 is 8.26 and then you can compare the decimal numbers.)

(meledestus' idea:)
After the unit is teleported its movepoints are reduced according to the movepoints spent on the path from the destination hex to the alternative hex (but if the resulting movepoints are negative then they are set to zero).
(Notice there is no rule that prevents the unit to be teleported further than the unit could reach on an empty map. )

Zones Of Control (ZOC)
ZOC may be caused by an enemy unit ...
a) adjacent to the starting teleport hex (except the teleported unit started its turn there)
b) adjacent to the destination teleport hex
c) standing on the destination teleport hex
d) (new!) adjacent to the alternative (=real) destination hex (in case the destination hex is occupied)
Conquest- new teleports.7z
Conquest Minus version 3.1.11.15
in order to play copy 'Conquest-' to an appropriate directory, read http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/EditingWesnoth#Where_is_my_user_data_directory.3F
(734.78 KiB) Downloaded 140 times

Edit 3:
First of all I want to stress that both systems that are described above/below are provisional:

Once Wesnoth 1.12 is out I will probably implement this system: http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php ... 68#p549068
Wesnoth 1.12 should allow to control the fog and so see through teleports, and so it will be worth to work on a definitive system.
a system that shall not be implemented
Now about the system that is described in the first half of this post: the removal of movepoints causes the teleport movement is closer to the standard Wesnoth movement.
Here are some thoughts about another system that would make the teleport movement even more 'normal' (but I don't think I would implement it, because the system that is planned for 1.12 is the 'normalest' one):

If there are no enemy unit around a teleport, then the movement may be normal (except a move between source and destination hexes requires no move): after a unit will be teleported with moves>0, the player shall choose where to continue to: he shall choose one of the hexes that are
- adjacent to the destination hex or adjacent to the continuous group of allied units connected to the destination hex AND
- accessible according to movepints left

If there is no enemy unit on the destination hex and simultaneously at least one adjacent enemy unit then ZOC should not stop the unit completely but to allow to step down from the teleport.
This way the teleport defender cannot block the teleport with 2 units forever.

If there is an enemy unit on the destination hex then it should be attackable from the source hex. Or another rule is needed in order to avoid to block the teleport easily.

wtf_is_this
Posts: 55
Joined: March 24th, 2010, 7:01 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by wtf_is_this » February 3rd, 2014, 12:44 pm

HEHEHELOOOOL evryone ,its time for me to come back for some conquest- games ;).I am logging in the wesnoth server somewhere between 15 00 and 23 00 GMT ,so if anyone wants to play some 1on1/2on2 wesnoth games message me here or in the server ;).I would also like to try out the conquest ladder if anyone is willing to play vs me

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Blop
Posts: 76
Joined: May 22nd, 2011, 6:49 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by Blop » February 12th, 2014, 12:05 am

Replay where I explain tactics for the start of the game.

More can follow if other players are instructed.
Attachments
Conquest-_Wesnoth_(requir..._Wiederholung_anzeigen.gz
(100.55 KiB) Downloaded 143 times

SlowThinker
Posts: 876
Joined: November 28th, 2008, 6:18 pm

Conquest Minus 3.2.0 + 3.2.1 + 3.2.2 + 3.2.3 + 3.2.4 + 3.2.5

Post by SlowThinker » March 16th, 2014, 12:47 pm

details of 3.2.0, 3.2.1, 3.2.2, 3.2.3, 3.2.4, 3.2.5 (obsolete)
Conquest Minus 3.2.0

for players:
Changes that affect the game mechanics:
  • Fixed: a Conquest- bug that didn't remove the sight of killed units
  • Fixed: a Wesnoth bug that allowed to watch enemy movement in fog (https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?21661)
  • The system of teleports has changed. Players should not be confused because now there is also a visual change: in past teleport runes were purple, now the are white. Also teleported units get floating texts.
    Now the teleport rules are slightly more complicated than before, but tricks at teleports (related to a 'jump' from am occupied destination hex to an alternate hex) are not possible anymore:
    - it is assured that no unit can reach a village (even a passenger from a boat) through a teleport, unless it has enough real movepoints to achieve it.
    - a unit can still get further with a 'jump' than it could move without it, but in that case it loses all movepoints.
    For details read this post
Changes that don't affect the game mechanics:
  • System labels (village labels, autolabels, teleport labels) may be hidden/restored. To hide labels may be useful so that numbers created by ctrl-v and ctrl-b are better visible.
    Unfortunately this feature is complicated by these Wesnoth bugs: https://gna.org/bugs/?21708 , https://gna.org/bugs/?21486 . Therefore labels are hidden/restored also for observers.
  • In the context menu new items were added for teleports and Wesnoth shows only 7 items. Therefore the number of items in the context menu has been decreased and some items were moved to 'Preferences' and 'Unit info'.
  • In order to prevent effects of misclicks, multiturn moves of units may be disabled in Preferences.
  • Floating texts were changed. Now any special command is followed by a special floating text, so that commands are visually distinguished.
  • In the game beginning instructions for newbies are shown in the chat area.
  • In games of 2 teams the first player can choose "Bargain Procedure". It represents a support for a spawn-vetoing procedure or any similar procedure in rated/tournament games. Only turn 1 is played, then players evaluate positions and write their texts, that decides whether the game will be continued.
Changes of maps:
in all maps: removed deprecated flowers
  • New Age Pasarganta, ver. 2.3
  • Dative, ver. 1.4
    the bonus of Center is decreased from 6 to 5, so that it is not so easy to detect a side in Center
  • Lotrando, ver. 1.29
    Morbak is not easily blockable anymore (added one recruit point)
    Broinia got more water around
    little terrain changes around Dark Forest
  • Poland (1 vs 1 version), ver. 1.07
    the area between Wielkopolska, Lodzkie and Kujawy adopted terrain from 'Poland with teleports', and therefore elves from Gniezno lost some of their power
  • Liquergue (teleports), ver. 1.4
    villages of Morton Swamp are connected by boats again
  • Europe, ver. 1.1 (no version change)
    village labels contain also the region bonus
for scenario creators:
In scenarios it is possible to change properties of a standard Conquest unit, of a standard attack and of standard resistances: it is possible to redefine prc_set_unit_conquest, tag_conquest_attack, tag_conquest_resistance.

Example: the file add-ons/Conquest-/scenarios/unused/xanthor_swarm.cfg adds a "swarm" ability to all attacks in Conquest-. Search for a text 'modifications of the main code' in the file, or compare xanthor_swarm.cfg and xanthor.cfg
Note: the scenario will work only if moved to add-ons/Conquest-/scenarios/xanthor_swarm.cfg
____________________________________
Conquest Minus 3.2.1

Bug fix:
  • fixed a serious bug in the Bargain Procedure, which made the Bargain Procedure unusable
it still contains two bugs:
ships have movecost 2 in swamps
a replay is corrupted if the game started by the Bargain Procedure (if you need to repair a replay then ask me)

____________________________________
Conquest Minus 3.2.2

Bug fixes:
fixed: ships had movecost 2 in swamps, although they shall not access swamp hexes.
fixed: the effect of this Wesnoth bug, which corrupted replays of games that started by the Bargain Procedure
Changes that don't affect the game mechanics:
Multiturn moves of units are disabled by default
The setting (On/Off) of Multiturn moves is common for whole team
____________________________________
Conquest Minus 3.2.3

Bug fixes:
fixed: two bugs in the Bargain Procedure:
  • multiturn moves could be brought from a Bargain Procedure to a real game
  • movement of units in turn 2 was not fully prevented
  • added a warning about the Wesnoth planning mode during the Bargain Procedure
Changes that don't affect the game mechanics:
  • The way how the starting gold may be adjusted in the game lobby is changed: the default starting gold is represented by 400g, and +/-25g in the lobby represents +/-1g in the game
    Newly also starting base income may be adjusted in the game lobby.

    (Notice an increased starting base income may make games more balanced, but there are other side effects too.)
Changes of maps:
  • Europe Classic, ver. 1.2
    it has been renamed from 'Europe'
  • Europe, ver. 1.2
    it is equal to 'Europe Classic', except there is one country per a region
  • Wesnoth (for newbies)
    this is a new scenario without boats (since boats may confuse newbies)
____________________________________
Conquest Minus 3.2.4

Bug fixes:
  • fixed: a bug that prevented most of recruits
  • fixed: a minor bug in the scenario Test Your Strength
____________________________________
Conquest Minus 3.2.5
(it may be downloaded from the 1.10 and 1.11 add-on servers)

Bug fix:
  • fixed: savefiles created in turn 1 weren't playable unless created within the Bargain Procedure
Changes that don't affect the game mechanics:
  • The Bargain Procedure caused problems with the Wesnoth's planning mode, and also players weren't able to reload the Bargain Procedure. Therefore now the Bargain Procedure is not turned off automatically but it must be turned off manually from a context menu.
Conquest Minus 3.2.5

This is a summary of all versions from 3.2.0 to 3.2.5.

for players:
Changes that affect the game mechanics:
  • Fixed: a Conquest- bug that didn't remove the sight of killed units
  • Fixed: a Wesnoth bug that allowed to watch enemy movement in fog (https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?21661)
  • The system of teleports has changed. Players should not be confused because now there is also a visual change: in past teleport runes were purple, now the are white. Also teleported units get floating texts.
    Now the teleport rules are slightly more complicated than before, but tricks at teleports (related to a 'jump' from am occupied destination hex to an alternate hex) are not possible anymore:
    - it is assured that no unit can reach a village (even a passenger from a boat) through a teleport, unless it has enough real movepoints to achieve it.
    - a unit can still get further with a 'jump' than it could move without it, but in that case it loses all movepoints.
    For details read this post
Changes that don't affect the game mechanics:
  • System labels (village labels, autolabels, teleport labels) may be hidden/restored. To hide labels may be useful so that numbers created by ctrl-v and ctrl-b are better visible.
    Unfortunately this feature is complicated by these Wesnoth bugs: https://gna.org/bugs/?21708 , https://gna.org/bugs/?21486 . Therefore labels are hidden/restored also for observers.
  • In the context menu new items were added for teleports and Wesnoth shows only 7 items. Therefore the number of items in the context menu has been decreased and some items were moved to 'Preferences' and 'Unit info'.
  • In order to prevent effects of misclicks, multiturn moves of units are disabled by default, and may be enabled in 'Preferences'. This setting is common for whole team.
  • Floating texts were changed. Now any special command is followed by a special floating text, so that commands are visually distinguished.
  • In the game beginning instructions for newbies are shown in the chat area.
  • In games of 2 teams the first player can choose "Bargain Procedure". It represents a support for a spawn-vetoing procedure or any similar procedure in rated/tournament games. Only turn 1 is played, then players evaluate positions and write their texts, that decides whether the game will be continued.
  • The way how the starting gold may be adjusted in the game lobby is changed: the default starting gold is represented by 400g, and +/-25g in the lobby represents +/-1g in the game
    Newly also starting base income may be adjusted in the game lobby.
    (Notice an increased starting base income may make games more balanced, but there are other side effects too.)
Changes of maps:
in all maps: removed deprecated terrain (flowers)
  • New Age Pasarganta, ver. 2.3
  • Dative, ver. 1.4
    the bonus of Center is decreased from 6 to 5, so that it is not so easy to detect a side in Center
  • Lotrando, ver. 1.29
    Morbak is not easily blockable anymore (added one recruit point)
    Broinia got more water around
    little terrain changes around Dark Forest
  • Poland (1 vs 1 version), ver. 1.07
    the area between Wielkopolska, Lodzkie and Kujawy adopted terrain from 'Poland with teleports', and therefore elves from Gniezno lost some of their power
  • Liquergue (teleports), ver. 1.4
    villages of Morton Swamp are connected by boats again
  • Europe Classic, ver. 1.2
    it has been renamed from 'Europe'
  • Europe, ver. 1.2
    it is equal to 'Europe Classic', except there is one country per a region
  • Wesnoth (for newbies)
    this is a new scenario without boats (since boats may confuse newbies)
for scenario creators:
In scenarios it is possible to change properties of a standard Conquest unit, of a standard attack and of standard resistances: it is possible to redefine prc_set_unit_conquest, tag_conquest_attack, tag_conquest_resistance.

Example: the file add-ons/Conquest-/scenarios/unused/xanthor_swarm.cfg adds a "swarm" ability to all attacks in Conquest-. Search for a text 'modifications of the main code' in the file, or compare xanthor_swarm.cfg and xanthor.cfg
Note: the scenario will work only if moved to add-ons/Conquest-/scenarios/xanthor_swarm.cfg
Attachments
Conquest- 3.2.5.7z
(929.74 KiB) Downloaded 111 times
Last edited by SlowThinker on March 27th, 2015, 11:58 pm, edited 3 times in total.

SlowThinker
Posts: 876
Joined: November 28th, 2008, 6:18 pm

Conquest Minus for Wesnoth 1.11

Post by SlowThinker » March 24th, 2014, 12:10 am

Conquest Minus is available for Wesnoth 1.11 (=Wesnoth 1.12 beta)

It is just a copy of Conquest Minus for Wesnoth 1.10, and doesn't make any use of new features of Wesnoth 1.11/1.12.

Edit: It requires Wesnoth 1.11.15 and above
I work on Conquest Minus • I use DFoolWide, Retro Terrain Package and the add-on 'High Contrast Water'
I moved to Nosebane's corner (Doc Paterson's signature); I am spending my time there, so PM me if I don't answer your post in forums

wtf_is_this
Posts: 55
Joined: March 24th, 2010, 7:01 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by wtf_is_this » July 6th, 2014, 10:33 am

Hello guys.Wtf is back in the bussines,Feel free to play 1on1 against me(ladder only) in this OUSAM GEIM.Message me in wesnoth lobby or in the forum

User avatar
Blop
Posts: 76
Joined: May 22nd, 2011, 6:49 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by Blop » July 15th, 2014, 2:29 pm

Hey guys :)

I just started on my new project: a completely new map!
The general idea is the following: a huge circle-shaped island (map size is max: 200x200), divided like this: a big human kingdom in the middle, kingdoms of the other 6 "land"-factions around it in the following order: dwarves at 12 o'clock, Khalifa at 2, Elves at 4, Drakes at 6, Orcs at 8, Undead at 10. Mermen will have the sea, of course, and maybe a few lakes. This doesn't mean that you will find no other factions in those areas though. The map is going to be huge, after all. But the specific areas will have a land shape that generally favors those factions.
I will try to create many different landshapes and fighting areas with lots of options and will later need much help balancing the mess.

Some ideas I currently have are:

- lots of castles at the perimeter of the human Kingdom, especially near fords and bridges
- several rivers around the human kingdom that connect to a wide system
- one big river wider than 1 tile (2 or even 3 further downstream) that leads into undead swamps
- mermen kingdoms at around 2-3 o'clock and 8 o'clock (I don't want flyers exactly near those) and some smaller settlements spread across the map
- one capital of sorts for each land faction
- no flyers where they don't belong: that means stray dwarf/drake/undead villages will be rare (which makes sense because dwarves keep to themselves and drakes/undead are not very welcome)
- it is possible to create 1 or 2 "rooms", maybe a cave for dwarves and a tunnel system for humans, in corners of the map and connect them with the mainland by teleports (they are not reachable by other means then)
- one or two underwater cave entrances where only mermen can move
- the idea of tunnels (that are not caves) could be mainly used for humans and orcs

The terrain for each faction should look like this:
- lots of flat for humans, maybe some lakes and many rivers, I am thinking about placing a giant castle with inside area and own bonus
- mountains + several caves for dwarves (capital is supposed to be a huge cave)
- lots of sand for khalifa of course, maybe a big lake
- forest for elves of course
- some volcanos and jagged terrain for drakes: sand/mountains/hills/impassable rivers etc. and few port towns
- hills for orcs, less port towns than others
- swamps, contorted terrain with deep waters, I will try to keep no mermen close
- mermen with 2 sort-of capitals, some islands with fewer port cities (maybe something for drakes and mermen, no ships to reach)

The general idea is that the map contains a story; I will also try to name villages and bonuses accordingly.


I will not start putting villages and balance things until SlowThinker has an alpha for the unit update ready.

I expect to be working on this mammoth project all summer and hope to have an alpha ready in autumn/winter.
If any of you have input or suggestions, feel free to message me. I would especially appreciate suggestions for landshapes.

Regards, Blop
Last edited by Blop on July 16th, 2014, 12:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Blop
Posts: 76
Joined: May 22nd, 2011, 6:49 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by Blop » July 16th, 2014, 12:32 pm

For the idea of underwater cave entrances i would need a terrain where no ships or flyers could move. I don't think such a thing exists yet. Is it possible to create such tiles for Conquest Minus? If yes, I would also like to ask for a tile for tunnels that lets any unit move one hex per turn.

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Blop
Posts: 76
Joined: May 22nd, 2011, 6:49 pm

Re: Conquest Minus

Post by Blop » September 21st, 2014, 2:45 pm

While xy complained about elite AI disguised as infantry killing his attackers in one of our games, I came up with an interesting mod idea for Conquest Minus:
Hiding the strength of AI units until any player (alternatively only the specific player, this would be harder to do i guess) fights that unit.

Just an idea, nothing that should be worked on until a Conquest update is done, of course :P

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