The same unit in two factions

[Glowing Fish]

I have a question about what the developer's ideas about having the same unit in two (or more) factions is.

Currently the only unit that is like this is the Mage (and Mage line). I know that at one point, there was at least one other unit like this (the Naga, by Loyalists and Northerners).

Is it a design point that factions should have all unique units? Was the mage just left with both Rebels and Loyalists for historical reasons? Is there even the faintest future plans of having an Elvish Mage? Or does the Mage really and truly belong with the Rebels, both in aesthetics and balance?

[Eleazar]

Or does the Mage really and truly belong with the Rebels, both in aesthetics and balance?

I've never felt it truly belonged. It's not horrible, but i'd rather see an elvish unit or branch replace it.

[zookeeper]

Well, I think the whole Rebels faction doesn't make any sense in the first place. In real Wesnoth history, the "rebels" had plenty of horsemen, dwarves, outlaws and all kinds of mermen in addition to what they have in the default era.

[tsr]

So maybe it's time to kick the mage and fish out of the rebel faction, rename it to wood-elves and create a flying magic using unit to compensate?

/tsr

[CIB]

Give the shamans wings and you won't have to <.<

[Mythological]

There was a magical fire-wielding fairy unit proposed as a replacement for the mage in the Rebel faction last year, but it was rejected by the MP developers . The explanation was that its alignment ( neutral ) and movetype
is too similar to the one of the elves, which is not encouraging the players to take into account the the differences between the races into their play

[jb]

lol, I was just posting in the idea's thread about this similar topic. This seems to come up every few months or so.

http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15780

See Mythological's old post here.

http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic. ... ht=#184955

[Becephalus]

This is probably my biggest personal complaint about wesnoth. It drives me nuts and I never ever buy elf mages and have not for over a year because of it. Elves dont need mages, and if they have one it shouldnt be a copy of the human mage. But alas no one cares what i think.

It is just ugly

you guys really know how to pull me out of my wesnoth hibernation...

[Chris NS]

The current default multiplayer factions are far more interested with playability and balance than asthetics, and all sorts of liberties are taken to achieve this, like the arbitrary alliance between dwarves and outlaws, or drakes and saurians. Human mages in an elf-dominated factions (which does at least have some resemblance to a major SP campaign) is the least of the discrepancies.

There might be scope for revisiting the old race-only factions (i.e. Human-loyalist, Human-rogue, Elves, Dwarves, Undead etc.) which the Extended Era does to some extent. But bear in ind that a lot of work will have to go into this. And no, I'm not volunteering.

[UngeheuerLich]

In 1.2.3. nothing happens. In 1.3.1. some serious balance changes happened:

elves don´t have any cold damage anymore, but they have two holy magical damage dealers, two healers. At least the white mage is useles for elves now, this thread gets a new relevance, but:

it is solely the mp develepors decision to change a unit, and it is very difficult for balance reasons to exchange a unit. And before i get bashed by Noy again because i warm up old thinks, I leave this thread, because I personally have no idea.

[CIB]

Sorceresses do holy damage? Oh well, it was never very realistic, actually any mage should be able to do like 5 different damage types since they usually know more than only one spell =)

[Haibane]

Sorceresses do holy damage? Oh well, it was never very realistic, actually any mage should be able to do like 5 different damage types since they usually know more than only one spell =)

Heh, how many mages do you know personally ?
Sorry for OT

Well, to join party, I don't like human mage in rebels faction either, fire fairy would be much better. But I would say no to graphic change, there is no point to have same (or very similar) units with different graphic.
But imho rebels need some lv1 fire (or holy in 1.3) Becephalus, otherwise it could be real pain to fight woses or skeleton fighters fe. Shamans and fighters could make job, but it would be painful. Well, I have never tried.

Nevermind, it was already rejected.

[Noy]

First off the mage is included for two reasons. One its in HTTP that mages are brought into the elvish faction, and therefore it makes sense to include them in MP under the same house as well. Second its designed to break up the movetype so that you don't have all units from one type or another in a faction. Thats a key aspect of faction design. By removing the mage you'd be down to only one unit with a different movetype in the rebel faction, something we'd like to avoid. (excluding water and scout units, which are not balanced in the same way).

Also the white mage will probably nolonger be an option for advancement for the Elvish mage tree. It makes little sense to have a religiously minded character in elvish society, and it is made irellevant by the presense of the shaman.

[JW]

First off the mage is included for two reasons. One its in HTTP that mages are brought into the elvish faction, and therefore it makes sense to include them in MP under the same house as well.

What's the //www for that website?

[Gus]

JW, you've never heard of the infamous campaign Heir to the Phone?