main theme - revisited

[galicae]

After the shock I received when I initially entered the music and sounds department of the forum (I really feel noob for posting this), I finally overcame myself:

the first thing I memorized about Wesnoth was the main theme you listen to when you start the game. I found it gorgeous, and it really is a pity that it isn't used in-game. I figured another take (hence the "revisited") could fix this. I wrote it really quick, so it really isn't polished, plus I don't have the theoretical background to support it.
Although West dislikes midis, anyone with a VLC media player (or a windows media player, for that matter) should be able to listen to it. Please tell me what you think of it!

hope what I did is not a sacrilege

[Unnheulu]

(Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) Doesn't midi just use the system-sound font? In that case if you have a different sound-font installed then doesn't that mean that those instruments wouldn't play?

[Dixie]

AFAIK, Unnheulu is right. However, I think midi can be useful to judge the composition in itself, since it's so small to cary around and send, and you can produce it easily before having gone through all the lengthy mixing stage. To me, a midi is like a portrait's line work (or flats). It's of couse unfinished and unprofessionnal in itself, but it isn't without uses.

As for the piece, I think it might be a bit slow? It's also pretty empty and undynamic (but it's finale midi, so... ) I don't overly remember the main them either, since I mostly play the game on mute (sorry, music composers, your work is still excellent )

[West]

Although West dislikes midis, anyone with a VLC media player (or a windows media player, for that matter) should be able to listen to it

Really?

No suitable decoder module:
VLC does not support the audio or video format "MIDI". Unfortunately there is no way for you to fix this.

[Sapient]

I don't overly remember the main them either, since I mostly play the game on mute

Oh wow, and you're posting that in the Music forum?

Totally shameless, dude.

[galicae]

shoot, that's really embarrassing... any thoughts on the arrangement itself? What do you mean by "empty and undynamic" Dixie?
(Sooo loong Dixie/
sweet Dixie girl you sure had styyle --- by Blood, Sweat & Tears. No offense but your nickname reminded me of it)

So a MIDI is pretty much useless, isn't it? What could I do to keep the quality I achieve with the program's sound banks (it does have nice woodwind and brass)?

[West]

galicae: This is what I hear when I listen to the piece in WMP (and no, it's not actually louder than that; I thought about normalizing it but figured it better to just record what I was hearing).

I'm sorry but I can't even hear the relation to the main theme :/ Let me guess, there's stuff missing?

This is the reason why midi is a worthless as a distributable format, and why we don't normally accept it.

I don't overly remember the main them either, since I mostly play the game on mute

Oh wow, and you're posting that in the Music forum?

Totally shameless, dude.

Meh, it's better than the guy who said he listens to hip hop when playing Wesnoth.

[galicae]

no, it's all there! it's supposed to be an arrangement of the music you listen to right after you start the game. It is composed by Aleksi Aubry-Carlson and the original title is "Main Theme". Mine is almost the double duration, and it is kinda less epic and heroic. There is not much originality in it; it's just an arrangement.

About the MIDI, I'm sorry. I will definitely not do that again. I'll find a way (I think Guitar Pro can import MIDI and export mp3).

I'm sorry but I can't even hear the relation to the main theme :/

Dude, I'm totally worthless...
by the way, how much time do you usually need to compose a piece - after you've had the idea?

[Dixie]

shoot, that's really embarrassing... any thoughts on the arrangement itself? What do you mean by "empty and undynamic" Dixie?

Sorry for taking some time to answer, I just didn't take the time to listen to your piece some more and get more of a constructed criticism.

So, and anybody feel free to contradict me, I generally think your piece has too much space. It is a bit empty, I think. Let me try to explain. To some extent, I think to poor quality of midi sounds, coupled with the robotic square feel, generates part of this feeling. I also think you may lack some harmonies. You have a lot of "unisons" and octaves. Try to voice that a bit more, maybe? There's also a lot of room in the basses. It could be driven forward a lot by some timpani rolling and giving the time down there - maybe try to experiment with that? It is also a bit slow to start, maybe you could remove a bar of those 4 quarter notes played by... trombone? Tuba? Can't really tell with the actual sound. I kind of liked the string tutti around 1:00, if the rest was a bit heavier/more driven forward, this passage could be extended a bit and give a great sounding variation. Maybe playing a bit more with "nuances" (volumes) could have create interesting contrasts, too? Interestingly, the piece starts moving a bit more around 1:30, but it sadly only lasts for a few seconds. Maybe you could try to work on extending that feeling to the rest of the piece?

Well anyway, hope it can help you. If anybody disagrees with a suggested fix, please do. I've got some bases, but I'm not really a mature composer/arranger, especially for orchestras.

[galicae]

I'm not really a mature composer/arranger, especially for orchestras.

while I, on the other hand, am an accomplished musician, arranger AND composer, working, among others with the Berliner Philarmoniker, the Metropolitan Opera and the London Symphony Orchestra.

yeah, I get what you mean. It was rather hastily written, and the opening (contrabass pizzicato and celli) was meant to create a rythmic basis, along with the violins, that would lend some originality to the piece, and not make itt sound like a rip-off. which is exactly what it is. Whenever I have access to my computer again I'll give it a try.
I never was good with percussion, though. At all.

The shoot part was about my total ignorance concerning vlc, not your criticism. I am honored you guys take the time to talk to me.

thx again!

[galicae]

about tiMIDIty, what do I need to make it play? I downloaded it and tried to play a midi file with it. It seemed to play it, only there was no sound, and there was a message telling there were no sounds assigned, or something.
I will provide more details if necessary, but any thoughts? Dixie?

[Dixie]

Hmm, well I'm not 100% sure why you target me for that midi question, especially since I haven,t really mentionned it earlier, am not a technic pro and have no real experience with tiMIDIty... Anyway, here's how I usually go about rendering my works:

- First, I write my whole thing up in some sheet music editor (it used to be Finale, but I recently switched to Sibelius 'cause I was sick and tired with Finale's crappy immutable chord notation). So I write it and when I'm satisfied with it, I export it as a midi (much like you've done, I'd guess).
- Second, I import it in some software (a DAW? I'm not really clear with that term). I personnally use Logic Studio, 'cause I'm used to it, but I might eventually switch to Pro Tools 'cause I have a recording class this semester and we're gonna work with that. I guess Garage Band could do the job too.
- Now, I usually clear all volume and panning effects placed on the midi (depends on the sheet music software - Finale put in a lot of these) and replace them with my own. This is also the time at which I try and choose my sound samples, apply reverb and any other effect I might like, humanise some tracks a bit, etc. You can also add some stuff to the composition itself at that time if need be.
- After that, I bounce the whole thing as whatever sound format suits my fancy.

Anyway, I'll say it again, I do not claim to have the cannonical/best way ever of doing this, and have not contributed anything to Wesnoth so far, so I don't really know how my stuff would compare to others' in here quality-wise. Also, it might be good for the final version, but it kinda is a lot of work for WIP demos. Although you could still keep the settings and just change the midi tracks if you edited the score on your sheet music software...