Wesnoth as a board game

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gio.longoni
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by gio.longoni »

Hi all

I like the idea of a Wesnoth board game!
I read the rules pdf 0.1 and I offer to translate it to my language, italian. I know this is little useful at this stage, but just want to contribute a little something :P , and it can anyway be useful to me if I'll decide to build and playtest something. About playtesting, anyway, I don't promise anything.

Is there any other downloadable archive, besides the rules? I saw some great printable units and terrain tiles samples in the messages above.

About Java
Kryzyzkowski wrote:If anyone has any objections to my development of the WBG-CG, please speak now.

Hi again everyone! First, thanks for the rules. I think I am ready to start coding.

Does anyone know a way to, using Java, make an application which displays a sprite on a double buffered canvas? I have done it with J2me, but have, so far, not found a SE method that I like.
just a hint: I think you'll have to use Java2D, like it or not.
Also try googling for

java2d game tutorial

Giovanni

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Czestmyr
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Czestmyr »

I read the rules pdf 0.1 and I offer to translate it to my language, italian.
Wow! Thanks for your help, man! As soon as we have a real draft (0.1 rules can't even be considered a draft), you can translate it. The sources will be available from the web, in accordance with the GPL license, so it shouldn't be a big technical problem.
Is there any other downloadable archive, besides the rules?
I have a bunch of images on my computer, but I refuse to publish them until the first playable version comes out, so that people don't start printing out the wrong versions of everything.

Ad Kryzyzkovski: If you're really into programming the computer version of the board game, I'd recommend you start thinking about the technology, you'll use (programming language, programming paradigms, data structures, algorithms, etc...), but don't code anything yet. The final rules may differ a lot from what we have now.

FInally, the most important:

I hate to repeat myself (especially in bold type), but we've come to a stage, where a single chat session could resolve so much, as opposed to many days of posting on forums. As the weekend is coming near, we could agree upon a chat somewhere (Jabber, IRC, www) and sometime so as to suit everyone willing to participate.

Kryzyzkowski
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Kryzyzkowski »

Hi everyone.

Thanks for the Java advice.

About the chat meeting: I have not had a working jabber account for years, I might set one up this weekend, but I have a bit of work that needs doing first. I'll post the user name later.

The features I am planning to make right now:

a picture background ( I hope to be able to use a map from the wesnoth board game, but a screenshot from the map editor will do for now.)

unanimated movement of sprites (click on a sprite to select it, click somewhere else to move it there, regardless of whether or not it is allowed to move there. This means the player will have to calculate movement and all that)

dice rolling (click on 1 of 8 dice images at the top of the screen to roll that dice. There will be 4 dice in top left corner, and 4 in top right)

delete a unit from the map(if it is killed)

add a unit to the map(if it is recruited)

That I think is enough to start with. Unit cards or lady luck I have not started thinking about yet. Or day/night tiles. I'll need some more rules as soon as this is finished. Maybe by the end of November, sooner, or later.

Could I please have a picture of a map, if there is one, pictures of the pawns, unit cards, and factions? Or a link to where they are found?

I guess we will not be having ranged attacks in WBG?

And the final rules differing is not much of a problem, If the ready to use application is anything like what I am planning, playtesters will at first have unit cards on the table, delete units when they die, and have to process the numbers the dice give them themselves.

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Czestmyr
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Czestmyr »

Kryzyzkowski wrote: And the final rules differing is not much of a problem, If the ready to use application is anything like what I am planning, playtesters will at first have unit cards on the table, delete units when they die, and have to process the numbers the dice give them themselves.
Oh! I didn't think about that that way. Good idea.

As for the images, there really aren't many of them. I am leaving right now, but when I return (an hour later or so), I'll send you what I have. But I must accent again - it's mostly drafts only.

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Czestmyr
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Czestmyr »

Kryzyzkowski wrote: I guess we will not be having ranged attacks in WBG?
Well, if you mean something like melee vs. ranged (as in original Wesnoth), I'd like to have something like that in WBG. But if you mean your idea of ranged attacks traversing more than one tile, I'd be against it because it would change the tactics a lot, which would also mean a lot of ballancing. Last, but not least, if you have smaller maps (which will most certainly be the case in order for the WBG maps to fit on a tabletop), being able to shoot further is a big advantage and we could end up with the players buying only units equipped with these ranged attacks. This would narrow down the number of real choices, which, again, is bad for the game ballancing. (read the article about ballancing, I linked above :eng: )

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dontano
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by dontano »

#gio.longoni: Se hai bisogno di aiuto per le traduzioni, io sono a tua completa disposizione. Dal momento che è difficile e raro parlare in italiano nel forum ufficiale, non ho problemi nell'aiutare un connazionale. :D (translation: if you need some help in translating the files, consider myself on the road. Even is it's quite abnormal to speak in our primary language in the official forum, I'd like to help people with my same nationality)

#everyone: Hi there. I watched this thread since the time it started, and I don't hide the fact that I'm quite interested on it. Whenever you need some help in something, just call me out via PM, and I'll try to do my best. Keep up the good job, guys :wink:
Trust yourself first, then trust others.
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gio.longoni
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by gio.longoni »

Czestmyr wrote:
Kryzyzkowski wrote: And the final rules differing is not much of a problem, If the ready to use application is anything like what I am planning, playtesters will at first have unit cards on the table, delete units when they die, and have to process the numbers the dice give them themselves.
Oh! I didn't think about that that way. Good idea.

As for the images, there really aren't many of them. I am leaving right now, but when I return (an hour later or so), I'll send you what I have. But I must accent again - it's mostly drafts only.

Another twocent advice... browse the downloadable Wesnoth source code for "alpha" unit cards and other images... better than taking a lot of screenshots. For the map a screenshot is indeed the best solution I can think of.

As for the ranged attacks, meaning attacks from hexes not adjacent to the attacked unit, I'm against that, too.
Obviously it's perfectly possible to experiment in that direction, too, but I think it's a good idea to try to stick to some features of the videogame (while at the same time trying to find the best way to simplify them for suitability in the BG).
Take a look to the "FREQUENTLY PROPOSED IDEAS" paragraph here:
http://wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1158

And also think about this: what you develop will be useful to people in this thread and they'll want to use it also when they will be willing to create future, customized WBG releases. Let's say Wesnoth 2.0 is out: we download and play it; it has many new units and races; we want to create similar units and cards for our WBG. WVG (videogame) people already made a big effort to balance the units of new races with the previous ones. We want this to be true "as much automatically" as possible also for the new WBG units. But it would be difficult, if we have old units that are too much different from the corresponding WVG ones.
That said, everyone is welcome to experiment with whatever customized features he wants to throw in his WBG branch :)
But I'd say: if he sticks at least to the "General principles" mentioned in the previous link, then his new units will be more likely to need little or no tweaking to be playable in the same game with older ones: a beautiful thing, though not a must

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Czestmyr
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Czestmyr »

gio.longoni wrote: Another twocent advice... browse the downloadable Wesnoth source code [...]

[...]
Take a look to the "FREQUENTLY PROPOSED IDEAS" paragraph here:
http://wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1158

And also think about this: what you develop will be useful to people in this thread and they'll want to use it also when they will be willing to create future, customized WBG releases. [...]
That said, everyone is welcome to experiment with whatever customized features he wants to throw in his WBG branch [...]
I couldn't possibly agree more with everything you said in your previous post. And thanks for the link to FPI. It was very educational for me ;)

edit: Some grammar mistakes :D

Kryzyzkowski
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Kryzyzkowski »

Hi again everyone!

I also agree with most of what gio.longoni wrote - more about it after java is finished

Do we have a list of units and stats somewhere, or is the one on the first post up to date? If it is, I have a few ideas on it, but I saw some talk about unit balancing earlier.

Is there an official map for this game which someone wants to see in the computer version? If anyone wants to make one for it, here is how: Use the wesnoth map editor, and post the file that creates. If, for some reason, you don't want to post it, email is also good.

about Java: double buffering and mouse usage are ready, I havn't gathered the graphics yet.

Xero D-g X
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Xero D-g X »

hope this idea isnt death...I mean...I´d like to play this with my lil bro and some friends...if the the project its still on....I offer to translate it to spanish....

saludos

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Turuk
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Turuk »

Image

After all this time, I would assume that this idea has indeed died, but Elricz is still around, so maybe he can post to give you some details on the progress or stalling of his project.
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elricz
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by elricz »

Actually, I haven't done any progress since the last post. The latest thing that I was playing with was to have simpler tokens on the board, and design a "control panel" for the units, where the players could track the status, but it never materialized on anything.

The hardest part for me was to find the right balance on terms of stats, and I don't think I achieved that on the first prototype. There will be no computer doing the calculations, so they should be simple, but not too simple that make an uninteresting game. Also, the way that they are going to be tracked is important, as it can restrict the values that you can use. For example, I cannot imagine using tokens to track hit points at the scale that they are in the game.

I don't think that I am going to work on this project in the near future, but feel free to reuse any of the material or ideas generated in the past.

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LemonTea
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by LemonTea »

Turuk wrote:Image
Would it really be thread necromancy considering how slow the Game Development board moves? :hmm: :lol2:
Last edited by LemonTea on January 4th, 2009, 5:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
JW's Wesnoth personality quiz wrote:You are a Skeleton: a lifeless animation of bone controlled by a necromancer. See a therapist.
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Cernunnos
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Cernunnos »

Hi,

I hope you'll continue since you took time to make up bases,

just a though, since i don't see much progress, would you consider it treason if i try on my side (just a though don't even know if i'll have time, motivation and competence for that)
What? I should draw mermen villages instead... oh sh*t... :lol2:
"While portrait art may be where Wesnoth gets its glamour, and sprite art may be where Wesnoth gets its zest, it's the terrain art that's so crucial to Wesnoth's polish - it's the canvas that the rest goes on." Sangel

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Czestmyr
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Re: Wesnoth as a board game

Post by Czestmyr »

Hey guys! The idea is far from being dead (at least if you asked me). It's just that the real life things like studies etc. sometimes get a higher priority.

The biggest problem with the board game as I see it now (from the top of my head) is what units the players will be allowed to recruit without having too much game material. We had a lot of discussions sbout this but didn't come to a conclusion. If anyone wants to help, just go ahead and read the whole thread and maybe then you could give us your ideas.

Take care everyone! And don't abandon good thoughts (Wesnoth board game)! Let them bloom and refine them over time. This WILL one day work, I promise ;)

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