[mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit names

Brainstorm ideas of possible additions to the game. Read this before posting!

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Developers

Forum rules
Before posting a new idea, you must read the following:
Post Reply

What should the Shuja -> Khalid be named?

Poll ended at February 2nd, 2018, 2:11 am

Dune Blademaster -> Dune Conqueror
4
24%
Dune Blademaster -> Dune Warmaster
6
35%
Dune Blademaster -> Dune Warlord
3
18%
Dune Champion -> Dune Warmaster
1
6%
Dune Champion -> Dune Conqueror
3
18%
 
Total votes: 17

Deciton_Reven
Posts: 93
Joined: August 6th, 2012, 4:49 pm

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Deciton_Reven » January 25th, 2018, 6:29 am

I mean, it's suggestive as to being a criminal act, but it's honestly what they are if the intent is they are anti-building or anti-siege weapon units in lore. And Arsonist is a nice sounding name, has a ring to it, a unique sound in a sea of names. We have suggestive names that are not true to the 't'. I doubt many, if any royal guards I've leveled have ever been actual royal guards. I've have some paladins slay villagers despite a paladins generally not doing that kind of thing, pillagers have friendly chats with locals in move to events with villages instead of, you know, pillaging.

That said my only real piece of advice is probably don't use "Flamer". It's more seen attached to internet trolls nowadays but I'm not sure the connotations it has involving gays has fully passed.

And I guess if Pyromaniac is deemed bad (though I have no problem with it) Pyro by itself is just shorthand for it and therefor isn't probably better. Pyrotrooper at least takes the root and uses it instead of leaving it vague to fill in the blank.

(Arsonist -> Scorcher -> Annihilator is the one I like the best though Firebrand and Pyrotrooper are both alright)

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3547
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Pentarctagon » January 25th, 2018, 9:50 am

What about:

Fire Thrower -> Firebrand -> Pyrotrooper
Firebrand -> Scorcher -> Pyrotrooper
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

Caladbolg
Posts: 138
Joined: January 1st, 2016, 4:40 pm
Location: Hopelessly trapped within the Submachine

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Caladbolg » January 25th, 2018, 2:18 pm

So, the names for the Naffat on the last 3 pages are as follows:
Annihilator, Arsonist, Burner, Combuster, Firebrand, Firespitter, Firestorm, Firethrower, Flamer, Igniter, Incinerator, Inferno, Scorcher, Pyro, Pyromaniac, Pyrotrooper, Torcher
I think Annihilator is too over the top, Arsonist and Pyromaniac make it seem like he's a deranged criminal, Burner is already used for Drakes and can be avoided, Firespitter seems more like a name for a Drake, Firestorm and Inferno seem like spell names, Flamer makes me think of internet trolls, Firethrower is a bit meh and Incinerator makes me think of a machine.

The passable ones for me are: Combuster, Firebrand, Igniter, Scorcher, Pyro (is it a problem that it's Greek?), Pyrotrooper (I think Firetrooper might sound better) and Torcher. Two more possibilities could be Engineer and Conflagrator. Oh, and there's also Naffat which I still think we could keep. In any case, I'm unsure on which ones would be the best and in which order.

User avatar
SigurdFireDragon
Developer
Posts: 404
Joined: January 12th, 2011, 2:18 am
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by SigurdFireDragon » January 26th, 2018, 1:44 am

Another attempt for the Jundi line.
I still like commando for the Mighwar, I find Flanker a little underwhelming for the unit. Not sure what else to suggest at the moment.
Jundi Line
ImageImageImage
Jundi Names: Rover
Muharib Names: Mercenary
Batal Names: Ranger
ImageImageImage
Jundi Names: see previous
Monawish: Skirmisher
Mighwar: Commando, Flanker
Some alternatives to the Jundi -> Batal that would reduce repetition compared to Fighter -> Warrior -> Champion:

Battler -> Warrior -> Champion
Fighter -> Battler -> Champion
Fighter -> Warrior -> Ranger


Combining & shuffling the latest suggestions from Deciton_Reven, Pentarctagon, & Caladbolg for the Naffat line:
Naffat Line
ImageImageImage
Naffat Names: Firebrand
Qatif-al-nar Names: Firetrooper
Tineen Names: Scorcher

User avatar
Celtic_Minstrel
Developer
Posts: 1225
Joined: August 3rd, 2012, 11:26 pm
Contact:

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Celtic_Minstrel » January 26th, 2018, 2:15 am

Rover is an interesting choice that could work well if we're going with the "liminal units are nomadic, lawful units are city-dwellers" angle, and ranger fits into that same theme. Mercenary on the other hand doesn't seem to fit. Skirmisher is fine, commando doesn't seem bad either.

So basically I think that name scheme for the jundi line is good, except for the muharib. I wonder if just scout would work? So you have rover -> scout -> ranger... or maybe scout -> rover -> ranger... I dunno...

As for that naffat suggestion (Sigurd's, to be quite clear) - it does seem to be the best I've seen so far, I guess. I'm least satisfied with "scorcher".
Author of The Black Cross of Aleron campaign and Default++ era.
Maintainer of Steelhive.

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3547
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Pentarctagon » January 26th, 2018, 6:54 am

I like Sigurd's Naffat suggestions as well, though I do also think Scorcher is a little bit lackluster for a level three unit. Pyrotrooper or Firestorm would be better, I think, and both of which sound like they could be the basis for a pretty flavorful unit description.

For the Jundi line, how about:

Jundi -> Dune Wanderer
Muharib -> Dune Adventurer
Batal -> Dune Explorer

Monawish -> Dune Skirmisher
Mighwar -> Dune Commander

I'm still not overly happy with the Skirmisher name, but I can't think of anything I like better at the moment either.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

Deciton_Reven
Posts: 93
Joined: August 6th, 2012, 4:49 pm

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Deciton_Reven » January 26th, 2018, 7:57 am

Pentarctagon wrote:I'm still not overly happy with the Skirmisher name, but I can't think of anything I like better at the moment either.
Perhaps Guerrilla or Operative? Guerrilla in particular would tie into what a Commando is (A small squad or member there of that specializes in tricky assaults) by being a step down in being far less trained and more reliant on tricky skirmishes in their home terrain instead of all terrains, while being a step up from a Wanderer in goals of moving around in tricky terrain.


I have to agree Scorcher is not very level three sounding, maybe a level one. A scorching desert heat is thematic and all but actual fire > being hot every time when it comes to intensity.

Maybe Firespitter -> Firebrand -> Firestorm? Really hammer in that fire while showing the control they have over it as they level up. From having fire but is not proficient with the device quite yet causing it to spit and sputter during use, to being the one that wields the fire instead of just having it, to being so skilled it seems like they are in complete control over the flames even after they are shot from the device.

Airatgaljamov
Posts: 63
Joined: April 12th, 2009, 6:04 pm

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Airatgaljamov » January 26th, 2018, 8:21 am

Pentarctagon wrote:I like Sigurd's Naffat suggestions as well, though I do also think Scorcher is a little bit lackluster for a level three unit. Pyrotrooper or Firestorm would be better, I think, and both of which sound like they could be the basis for a pretty flavorful unit description.
Burner -> Scorcher -> Pyro/Pyrotrooper

I'm in favor of this variant.
Pentarctagon wrote: For the Jundi line, how about:

Jundi -> Dune Wanderer
Muharib -> Dune Adventurer
Batal -> Dune Explorer
This suggestions not really corresponds to current Batal line description and idea. Jundi's description is flat and basically just describes him as if it was strategy subforum. Muharib's and Batal's descriptions hint that they are raiders, pilferers and pillagers. Now they are definitely not supposed to be explorers of unknown lands. So I don't think that would work.
However they are indeed gameplaywise have similarities with Dwarvish Explorer. If done this way maybe description can be changed to make Muharib and Batal actually explorers, who travel to the unknown, seek for water sources and fertile land, fight with terrible beast out there to clear the path for their nomad people and heard of horses.
Pentarctagon wrote: Monawish -> Dune Skirmisher
Mighwar -> Dune Commander

I'm still not overly happy with the Skirmisher name, but I can't think of anything I like better at the moment either.
I don't understand there er comes from. It changes meaning from special forces to the commanding officer.
May I suggest the name Harrier?
So my sugggestions are:

-->Skirmisher-->Harrier
-->Commando-->Harrier
-->Flanker-->Harrier

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3547
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Pentarctagon » January 26th, 2018, 9:07 am

Airatgaljamov wrote:
Pentarctagon wrote: For the Jundi line, how about:

Jundi -> Dune Wanderer
Muharib -> Dune Adventurer
Batal -> Dune Explorer
This suggestions not really corresponds to current Batal line description and idea. Jundi's description is flat and basically just describes him as if it was strategy subforum. Muharib's and Batal's descriptions hint that they are raiders, pilferers and pillagers. Now they are definitely not supposed to be explorers of unknown lands. So I don't think that would work.
However they are indeed gameplaywise have similarities with Dwarvish Explorer. If done this way maybe description can be changed to make Muharib and Batal actually explorers, who travel to the unknown, seek for water sources and fertile land, fight with terrible beast out there to clear the path for their nomad people and heard of horses.
At this point, I'd rather change the unit names to something more suitable, then if necessary the descriptions can be updated as well. I had assumed at least some would need updates anyway, to be honest, and I'd say most could probably be improved to be more interesting.
Airatgaljamov wrote:
Pentarctagon wrote: Monawish -> Dune Skirmisher
Mighwar -> Dune Commander

I'm still not overly happy with the Skirmisher name, but I can't think of anything I like better at the moment either.
I don't understand there er comes from. It changes meaning from special forces to the commanding officer.
May I suggest the name Harrier?
Commando to me seems like a much more modern name, so I was trying to keep it similar while removing the modern-ness of it.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3547
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Pentarctagon » January 27th, 2018, 1:09 am

The Arif -> Ghazi runoff poll is up. It will run for two days, and everyone gets one vote.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

User avatar
Celtic_Minstrel
Developer
Posts: 1225
Joined: August 3rd, 2012, 11:26 pm
Contact:

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Celtic_Minstrel » January 27th, 2018, 3:06 am

Wanderer -> adventurer -> explorer seems pretty decent. I definitely prefer commando to commander; if you want it to seem less modern, you'd need to think of another word with a similar meaning to commando, rather than a word that sounds similar. The suggestion of harrier seems decent, actually.
Author of The Black Cross of Aleron campaign and Default++ era.
Maintainer of Steelhive.

User avatar
SigurdFireDragon
Developer
Posts: 404
Joined: January 12th, 2011, 2:18 am
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by SigurdFireDragon » January 27th, 2018, 5:07 am

An attempt to solve issues with Scorcher in my last Naffat suggestion:
Scorcher -> Firebrand -> Firetrooper
Firebrand -> Scorcher -> Firetrooper

Firebrand -> Firebug -> Firetrooper
Firebug -> Firebrand -> Firetrooper
Airatgaljamov wrote:Burner -> Scorcher -> Pyro/Pyrotrooper

I'm in favor of this variant.
I'd be fine with Burner -> Scorcher -> Firetrooper/Pyrotrooper.
It seems like several here want to avoid Burner because of the duplication. If the Draker Burner hadn't taken it, I think it would have been a shoe-in for L1 or L2.

Dealing with issues with Mercenary for my last Jundi -> Batal line suggestion:
Rover -> Adventurer -> Ranger
Rover -> Explorer -> Ranger
Rover -> Adventurer -> Explorer

Airatgaljamov wrote:May I suggest the name Harrier?
So my sugggestions are:

-->Skirmisher-->Harrier
-->Commando-->Harrier
-->Flanker-->Harrier
I am starting to warm up to Harrier.

my preference would be for
Harrier -> Commando
Skirmisher -> Harrier

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3547
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Pentarctagon » January 28th, 2018, 3:16 am

So, in order to try to get this all in before 1.13.11 is released on February 4th, I'm going to be starting separate threads for the Jundi and Naffat line renaming polls once the current poll in this thread ends.

Based on the last couple pages, for the Jundi -> Muharib -> Batal suggestions are:
Light Infantryman > Mercenary > Veteran
Fighter -> Warrior -> Ranger
Wanderer -> Adventurer -> Explorer
Rover -> Adventurer -> Explorer
Rover -> Adventurer -> Ranger
Fighter -> Warrior -> Champion
Irregular -> Mercenary -> Veteran
Rover -> Roamer -> Wanderer
Mercenary -> Flanker -> Saboteur
Mercenary -> Ranger -> Saboteur
Rover -> Explorer -> Ranger
The Monawish -> Mighwar line suggestions are:
Skirmisher -> Commando
Skirmisher -> Harrier
Commando -> Harrier
Flanker -> Harrier
Harrier -> Commando
Duelist -> Champion
And the Naffat -> Qatif-al-nar -> Tineen line suggestions are:
Firebrand -> Firespitter -> Firestorm
Fire Thrower -> Firebrand -> Pyrotrooper
Firebrand -> Scorcher -> Pyrotrooper
Firespitter -> Firebrand -> Firestorm
Burner -> Scorcher -> Firetrooper
Scorcher -> Combuster -> Wildfire
Scorcher -> Combuster -> Firetrooper
Firebrand -> Scorcher -> Firetrooper
Torcher -> Firebrand -> Firetrooper
Naffat -> Scorcher -> Firetrooper
Firemaker -> Firemaster -> Firelord
Firewielder -> Firemaster -> Firelord
Flamemaker -> Flamemaster -> Flamelord
Flamewielder -> Flamemaster -> Flamelord
If anyone has any additional suggestions, or would like any of their suggestions above not included, please say so prior to the polls starting tomorrow. Also, for additional suggestions, please post the whole unit line rather than just a single name idea for a single unit. There will likely be runoff polls, and as a Forum Admin I can increase the maximum number of poll options temporarily to accommodate there being a lot of ideas, but I am not going to add a single name and all possible variations of it combined with the above suggested lines, and then create a poll with 50, 100, or more options.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

User avatar
Celtic_Minstrel
Developer
Posts: 1225
Joined: August 3rd, 2012, 11:26 pm
Contact:

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Celtic_Minstrel » January 28th, 2018, 4:20 am

I'm not sure where "firebug" came from, but that's giving me some ideas...
  • Firebird - presumably this would refer to their upgraded flamethrower.
  • Fireflight or some minor variation of it
  • Firewind, Windfire, Flamewind
  • Firewhirl or flamewhirl
  • Firebeast
Any thoughts on these? I'd imagine them to be for an L3 unit, with the L1 being firetrooper and the L2 being firebrand.

And apropos of nothing, I'll throw out one other idea unrelated to the above (though admittedly a Greek one): Pyrophile.

(I'll decide whether to propose a full unit line depending on responses to these.)
Author of The Black Cross of Aleron campaign and Default++ era.
Maintainer of Steelhive.

Airatgaljamov
Posts: 63
Joined: April 12th, 2009, 6:04 pm

Re: [mainline] Changing the Dunefolk's(Khalifate's) unit nam

Post by Airatgaljamov » January 28th, 2018, 7:40 am

Pentarctagon wrote: Based on the last couple pages, for the Jundi -> Monawish -> Mighwar line suggestions are:
Fighter -> Mercenary -> Gladiator
Light Infantryman > Mercenary > Veteran
Battler -> Warrior -> Champion
Fighter -> Battler -> Champion
Fighter -> Warrior -> Ranger
Rover -> Mercenary -> Ranger
Wanderer -> Adventurer -> Explorer
Rover -> Adventurer -> Ranger
Rover -> Explorer -> Ranger
Rover -> Adventurer -> Explorer
The Muharib -> Batal suggestions are:
Skirmisher -> Commando
Skirmisher -> Harrier
Commando -> Harrier
Flanker -> Harrier
Harrier -> Commando
Just to note they should be the other way around. Batal - warrior line, Mighwar - skirmisher line. So

Jundi -> Muharib -> Batal
Fighter -> Mercenary -> Gladiator
Light Infantryman > Mercenary > Veteran
Battler -> Warrior -> Champion
Fighter -> Battler -> Champion
Fighter -> Warrior -> Ranger
Rover -> Mercenary -> Ranger
Wanderer -> Adventurer -> Explorer
Rover -> Adventurer -> Ranger
Rover -> Explorer -> Ranger
Rover -> Adventurer -> Explorer
-> Monawish -> Mighwar
Skirmisher -> Commando
Skirmisher -> Harrier
Commando -> Harrier
Flanker -> Harrier
Harrier -> Commando
And horseman lines are decided, right?

Post Reply