campaign triumph wreath according to level

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campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby perjantai » May 20th, 2017, 10:43 am

The campaign menu triumph wreath is currently the same independent of level, which the campaign has been played through. The triumph wreath type for the campaign could be depending on the hardest level which the campaign has been played through. The hardest to easiest in colours of wreaths could be for example: gold, silver, bronze, green, light green, blue and light blue. Normally, it seems that there are maximum 3 levels. The wreath with different colours would be more informative for the player. The player would notice "I have not played that campaign yet through with the hardest level!"

Proposal examples for campaign triuph wreaths
1 difficulty level triumph wreath colour: gold
2 difficulty levels colours: gold, silver
3 difficulty levels colours: gold, silver, bronze
7 difficulty levels colours: gold, silver, bronze, green, light green, blue, light blue
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Bitron » May 20th, 2017, 11:55 am

I do like that idea. I always thought that they should be some kind of indication which difficulty I have played the campaign. This seems like a good way to do that for me.
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » July 23rd, 2017, 2:34 am

This seems like a good idea, and a bronze-silver-gold progression for campaigns with 3 difficulties makes a lot of sense. The only problem is, what do you do with campaigns that have more or less than 3 difficulties? Your proposal for 7 difficulty levels doesn't make any sense to me, honestly. For four difficulty levels I suppose a green one could work for the lowest (essentially, make the wreath be actual foliage rather than a metal replica of foliage). But for campaigns that add more difficulties? I think the best way would probably to add a way for campaigns to specify an image to be used for the wreath... like a new key in [difficulty]...
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby skeptical_troll » July 23rd, 2017, 9:58 am

It could just be Gold,silver,bronze and whatever is lower always copper. I don't think there are many campaigns with more than 4 difficulty levels anyway, even among UMCs. I think it is better to make this standard rather then customizable, if it's not a universal convention it would be meaningless.
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » July 24th, 2017, 3:20 am

I think bronze and copper might be a little too similar...
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby doofus-01 » July 24th, 2017, 5:03 am

Celtic_Minstrel wrote:I think bronze and copper might be a little too similar...
Replace "copper" with your "green" from earlier post, and it works.
skeptical_troll wrote: I don't think there are many campaigns with more than 4 difficulty levels anyway, even among UMCs. I think it is better to make this standard rather then customizable, if it's not a universal convention it would be meaningless.
Yeah.
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby beetlenaut » July 24th, 2017, 6:20 pm

skeptical_troll wrote:I don't think there are many campaigns with more than 4 difficulty levels anyway, even among UMCs.
Four is pretty rare too, so I think three laurels would be plenty. Everything below the third difficulty level could be bronze.

I think this is a great idea, but nothing is going to happen without some artwork. All this needs is a recoloring of the current one though, so here:
laurel-bronze.png
laurel-bronze.png (2.24 KiB) Viewed 742 times
laurel-silver.png
laurel-silver.png (2.34 KiB) Viewed 742 times
laurel-gold.png
laurel-gold.png (2.22 KiB) Viewed 742 times

Maybe this will move the topic along. :)
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » July 25th, 2017, 12:02 am

beetlenaut wrote:Four is pretty rare too, so I think three laurels would be plenty.
It might be rare, but there are macros in mainline for 4 difficulties, and Dead Water has 4 difficulties.

That said, while using green for the lowest in the case of 4 seems reasonable, there's also a minor problem with it - that means the laurel for Easy difficulty depends on how many difficulties there are. I think an extra one above gold would be better, but I'm not sure what that could be. (Not platinum. Though platinum is considered to be more valuable than gold in the modern era, it doesn't really have a medieval feel to it in my opinion and also would probably be difficult to differentiate from silver.)
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Samonella » July 25th, 2017, 3:10 am

Celtic_Minstrel wrote:That said, while using green for the lowest in the case of 4 seems reasonable, there's also a minor problem with it - that means the laurel for Easy difficulty depends on how many difficulties there are. I think an extra one above gold would be better, but I'm not sure what that could be. (Not platinum. Though platinum is considered to be more valuable than gold in the modern era, it doesn't really have a medieval feel to it in my opinion and also would probably be difficult to differentiate from silver.)
A gold one with lots of rubies and emeralds and things glistening all over? Ooh, it could have the ruby of fire instead of the little circle at the bottom.

beetlenaut wrote:I think this is a great idea, but nothing is going to happen without some artwork. All this needs is a recoloring of the current one though, so here:
Very nice! :D Imo the gold one is a little too saturated compared to the silver though.
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby zookeeper » July 27th, 2017, 8:52 am

Celtic_Minstrel wrote:That said, while using green for the lowest in the case of 4 seems reasonable, there's also a minor problem with it - that means the laurel for Easy difficulty depends on how many difficulties there are.

That's true, but can't really be avoided. It's still a better choice than having a special laurel for the fourth difficulty, since that would misleadingly imply that there's something specially super challenging about that difficulty compared to the hardest difficulty of other campaigns.

Anyway, if this is done via a new key in [difficulty], then in some cases the different laurels will get mixed up in other ways anyway; for example TB might have "easy" and "hard" laurels, skipping "normal" entirely, and some other campaign might have "beginner" (green), "normal" and "hard" but not "easy, and so on.

If one really wants to avoid the fact that the colour of the laurel doesn't really unambiguously tell the player which difficulty out of how many they've beaten the campaign, the indicator could be something else. For example, it could be a ØØO -style thing, where there are as many little laurels (or whatever) in a queue/stack as there are difficulties, and the correct number of them are coloured.

ØO <- 1/2 cleared
ØØØ <- 3/3 cleared
ØØOO <- 2/4 cleared
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby skeptical_troll » July 27th, 2017, 9:41 am

I think it is still better to just assign gold to the hardest difficult, even if it is defined as 'NORMAL', silver to the second hardest etc. If this is supposed to be a 'reward' for the player, he/she will want to see a full gold wreaths collection after beating all campaigns in the hardest mode available. It would be pretty annoying to have silver spots here and there just because that campaign only has 'easy' and 'normal'.

zookeeper wrote:If one really wants to avoid the fact that the colour of the laurel doesn't really unambiguously tell the player which difficulty out of how many they've beaten the campaign, the indicator could be something else. For example, it could be a ØØO -style thing, where there are as many little laurels (or whatever) in a queue/stack as there are difficulties, and the correct number of them are coloured.


A problem I see in this, beside the fact that it requires more work, is that a player that beats the 'hard' mode will never play the campaign again at an easier level. In other words, the goal should be to beat the most challenging of the modes, not necessarily all of them.
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » August 14th, 2017, 5:16 pm

Implemented. It wasn't that hard since it was already separately-tracked for each difficulty. I used beetlenaut's bronze and silver wreaths, but kept blarumyrran's gold wreath. The difficulty dialog still uses only the gold wreath. The lowest difficulty gets you a bronze wreath, the highest gets you a gold wreath, and any other difficulty gets you a silver wreath. This does assume that the difficulties are sorted from lowest to highest, though.


This does mean that A Tale of Two Brothers will never have a silver wreath, by the way.
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby doofus-01 » August 27th, 2017, 10:52 pm

Rather than just recolors, would it look better if the wreaths were different sizes as well? Leaving the gold one alone, but snipping off a bit from the silver and more from the bronze.
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laurel-bronze.png
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » August 28th, 2017, 3:40 am

I dunno. You could try it and see, I suppose?
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Re: campaign triumph wreath according to level

Postby doofus-01 » August 28th, 2017, 4:17 am

Celtic_Minstrel wrote:I dunno. You could try it and see, I suppose?
What is wrong with you?
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