Limiting defensive combat through attack number

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Eagle_11
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Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by Eagle_11 » February 2nd, 2015, 9:18 pm

Frequently ive seen scenarios like one unit gets surrounded on all surrounding hexes and still fights to bitter death. Whilst this is epic no matter which side the unit is belonging to and the aptly correspondant demeanor for the higher lvl units, its somewhat funny to see all units fight equally tireless in a prolonged battle within the most heroic fashion.
What i propose is to limit effectiveness of units whilst on defensive via creating a 'maximum times it can defend' that is linked to its total attack number(seperate for melee and ranged).
Example:
The Spearman has 3 try for melee and 2 try for ranged. This means during the opponent's turn he will defend against the first 3 melee attackers and 2 ranged attackers but will become vulnerable from there onwards as he can no longer retaliate(have used up his 'tries'). The individual combat itself is unchanged, all units still use their listed attack numbers during the combat normally and hit-miss continues to occur. An attack number equal to or higher than 6 would quasi mean 'always retaliates'.

This would allow encircling units to become a more reliable tactic as an lousy 1 hp left unit can no longer defy all 6 attackers on same turn through pure luck. Maybe also reduces complaints about wesnothian rng a bit as [censored] like this is what makes people complain at the first place.

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zookeeper
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Re: Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by zookeeper » February 2nd, 2015, 11:50 pm

Ought to be easy enough to do in WML.

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Eagle_11
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Re: Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by Eagle_11 » February 3rd, 2015, 4:00 pm

My apologies, for i didnt know this exists(along anything else that makes sense) as an entry in the FPI-list.

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Ravana
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Re: Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by Ravana » February 3rd, 2015, 6:06 pm

I read that response as "not suitable for core, feel free to create and play it yourself". I dont think it is frequently proposed.

I have tried to so something similar codewise, but eventually gave up as I couldnt get it to work as I wanted.
Tried to change attacks defense_weight(though defence would seem more natural to use for me).

I know that homm4 uses this kind of limitation, but I dont think it would have any use here.

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zookeeper
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Re: Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by zookeeper » February 3rd, 2015, 7:19 pm

Ravana wrote:I have tried to so something similar codewise, but eventually gave up as I couldnt get it to work as I wanted.
Tried to change attacks defense_weight(though defence would seem more natural to use for me).
Yeah, it might have been harder to do before, but with the [disable] weapon special it should be pretty straightforward; at turn start, set a counter variable in each unit, and have every unit's every attack have a [disable] special which filters on that counter.

...at least assuming that [disable] disables the attack also on defense, and I guess I'm not sure whether it does. It should, of course.

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nuorc
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Re: Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by nuorc » February 4th, 2015, 1:41 am

Eagle_11 wrote:What i propose is to limit effectiveness of units whilst on defensive via creating a 'maximum times it can defend' that is linked to its total attack number(seperate for melee and ranged).

...

This would allow encircling units to become a more reliable tactic as an lousy 1 hp left unit can no longer defy all 6 attackers on same turn through pure luck. Maybe also reduces complaints about wesnothian rng a bit as [censored] like this is what makes people complain at the first place.
I think it would have an impact on the balance. I frequently use Orcish Assassins not only to spread their love poison, but also to hold positions with their 60 or even 70% defenses. Good defenses compensate for weaknesses like low damage, HP etc... But even from an encircled point of view I often feel screwed by the rng. ;)
I have a cunning plan.

Can-ned_Food
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Re: Limiting defensive combat through attack number

Post by Can-ned_Food » March 2nd, 2017, 5:53 pm

Well, to resurrect a 2 year topic — has anyone done this?

I ask because I will, if not.

BTW, my 2¢ regarding “core” and non-core: There is less difference than it seems people tend to think.
Anyways, the real gains by using WML are the same as from implementing anything through a more flexible and configurable framework compared to hardcoding it in the engine. Nothing to do with mainline versus so–called UMC, IMHO.

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