TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
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Researcher
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- Joined: June 20th, 2011, 2:34 pm
TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
Please, read the article at RANDOM.ORG before discussing.
Here is the link: http://www.random.org/randomness/
This article states that TRNG is better for games and gambling.
As of today, RANDOM.ORG has generated 1,002 billion random bits for the Internet community.
Why not use it for BfW?
Here is the link: http://www.random.org/randomness/
This article states that TRNG is better for games and gambling.
As of today, RANDOM.ORG has generated 1,002 billion random bits for the Internet community.
Why not use it for BfW?
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
You realize that's their advertising copy you linked, basically, and that for most purposes PRNG is sufficiently random, right? You are suggesting that even playing Wesnoth offline (single player or hotseat)require an active internet connection. This is a bad idea for reasons that should be obvious.
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
As long as no one manages to present a good argument for why it should be used for BfW, trying to explain why it isn't seems fairly pointless.Researcher wrote:Why not use it for BfW?
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TheCricket
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Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
I think he's suggesting that Wesnoth Inc begin manufacturing small USB devices with radioactive material inside, and sell them to those of us who are fed up with how unrandom rand() really is.Caphriel wrote:You are suggesting that even playing Wesnoth offline (single player or hotseat)require an active internet connection. This is a bad idea for reasons that should be obvious.
I, for one, think it's a brilliant idea.
My boy, do not trust those who promise to make you rich overnight. They are usually either mad or charlatans! Heed my words, and turn back
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
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Researcher
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Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
OOPS... 
I forgot to say that it is meant to be used for online multiplayer games.
However, if you have Internet connection and play campaigns, it would be nice to be able to turn it on
P.S. WHY ? Because it would be nice to have a feeling that the hit/miss rate is not determined (pseudo-random is)
I forgot to say that it is meant to be used for online multiplayer games.
However, if you have Internet connection and play campaigns, it would be nice to be able to turn it on
P.S. WHY ? Because it would be nice to have a feeling that the hit/miss rate is not determined (pseudo-random is)
Last edited by Pentarctagon on July 6th, 2011, 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: you don't need to make your text larger
Reason: you don't need to make your text larger
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
Why is it an improvement to gameplay though? Are the pseudo-random numbers not random enough? Can you reliably demonstrate this?
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
Before you answer Gambit's question, I suggest doing some significant research into the topic. This thread is a recent discussion that includes some evidence that the PRNG is, in fact, sufficiently random. Additionally, use the search feature to poke around for other recent threads on the RNG. Finally, make sure you understand probability and statistics, as well as pseudo-random number generation, sufficiently well to argue your point. Discussions of the RNG in Wesnoth tend to derail and get locked pretty quickly.
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Researcher
- Posts: 8
- Joined: June 20th, 2011, 2:34 pm
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
OK, I think I am ready to answer to Gambit's question.
You wouldn't need USB radioactive stick or something - just a working Internet connection with RANDOM.ORG or another TRNG server.
So, the short form of Gambit's question is:
and that deviation can't be noticed by a usual player - only by a hardcore mathematician who collects a quite huge statistics on PRNG rolls.
But it is not a question about statistics.
Even if PRNG would be ideal, TRNG still has a VERY big advantage over PRNG.
So, what is the advantage?
The answer is...
SPIRITUALITY
Values generated by TRNG determined by the will of God,
values generated by PRNG determined by the will of machine.
Do you feel the difference ???
You know, a lot of humans don't believe at God at all.
But the ability to turn on the TRNG mode would be awesome for those who believe!
First of all, I would like to say that implementation of the TRNG is pretty easy.Why is it an improvement to gameplay though? Are the pseudo-random numbers not random enough? Can you reliably demonstrate this?
You wouldn't need USB radioactive stick or something - just a working Internet connection with RANDOM.ORG or another TRNG server.
So, the short form of Gambit's question is:
Well, since pseudo-random RNG is pretty random, I admit that statistics of PRNG has a very small deviation from the statistics of TRNG,Pseudo-random RNG used in BfW is pretty random! WHY IMPLEMENT TRNG ?
and that deviation can't be noticed by a usual player - only by a hardcore mathematician who collects a quite huge statistics on PRNG rolls.
But it is not a question about statistics.
Even if PRNG would be ideal, TRNG still has a VERY big advantage over PRNG.
So, what is the advantage?
The answer is...
SPIRITUALITY
Values generated by TRNG determined by the will of God,
values generated by PRNG determined by the will of machine.
Do you feel the difference ???
You know, a lot of humans don't believe at God at all.
But the ability to turn on the TRNG mode would be awesome for those who believe!
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
Researcher wrote:
Values generated by TRNG determined by the will of God,
values generated by PRNG determined by the will of machine.
Do you feel the difference ???
You know, a lot of humans don't believe at God at all.
But the ability to turn on the TRNG mode would be awesome for those who believe!
Ok...wait...
That post made my day.
/thread
Greetz
HomerJ
Six years without a signature!
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
ummm... ok... so you want TRNG to see if God likes you and gives you good outcome...? Seriously man, I don't know in which God you believe but most religions state that God loves every single human being. But anyway, I wanted to get one thing straight- do you believe that Wensoth RNG is not random enough? If that's the case, then you are probably the first person to say that (contrary to dozens of randomness haters). Just imagine the flood of "I hate Wesnoth" threads.
Oh, I'm sorry, did I break your concentration?
Re: TRUE RNG vs Pseudo-random RNG
Ah okay. I see now.
I really like the idea now. His Noodlyness would surely let me win every game then. (Though I don't quite understand why, being all powerful and what-not, he just doesn't manipulate the pseudo-random-number-generator for me already… )
But as much as I personally like the idea, it would give us religious people a HUGE unfair advantage, and that's probably an unwanted feature. Locked.
edit: It was remiss of me not to inform you that the Experimental Fork of Wesnoth does allow you to code custom RNGs and then lets users pick which one they want via a dropdown menu.
I really like the idea now. His Noodlyness would surely let me win every game then. (Though I don't quite understand why, being all powerful and what-not, he just doesn't manipulate the pseudo-random-number-generator for me already…
)But as much as I personally like the idea, it would give us religious people a HUGE unfair advantage, and that's probably an unwanted feature. Locked.
edit: It was remiss of me not to inform you that the Experimental Fork of Wesnoth does allow you to code custom RNGs and then lets users pick which one they want via a dropdown menu.