[UMC]all-factions-era

Brainstorm ideas of possible additions to the game. Read this before posting!

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Developers

Forum rules
Before posting a new idea, you must read the following:
Velensk
Multiplayer Contributor
Posts: 3991
Joined: January 24th, 2007, 12:56 am

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Velensk »

Out of vague curiosity, in cases where there are multiple versions of an era which would you use? Last I checked the celestials in EoM and the celestials in AE were were quite different due to the fact that the ones for the ageless era were rebalanced for it (though I'll admit to being highly dubious about how effective it was).

As a side note; I have no objection to EoFM being used in such an era as it sounds like you expect the players to select the options they think are balanced. I also have no objection to the halflings (from the grafted era) being used though mysticX might. I would rather that the gunpowder age was not used (though I don't see why anyone would want it).
"There are two kinds of old men in the world. The kind who didn't go to war and who say that they should have lived fast died young and left a handsome corpse and the old men who did go to war and who say that there is no such thing as a handsome corpse."

fog_of_gold
Posts: 637
Joined: December 20th, 2009, 5:59 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by fog_of_gold »

Gambit wrote:Yes but fog_of_gold, that system assumes that all eras are standard faction containing eras. What about eras that add events and what not?[...]
These eras mustn't be included since they contain new features. Exactly this is the reason I don't like the idea of your suggestion. Also, your suggestion would allow to have a hero+default era.
Velensk wrote:As a side note; I have no objection to EoFM being used in such an era as it sounds like you expect the players to select the options they think are balanced. I also have no objection to the halflings (from the grafted era) being used though mysticX might. I would rather that the gunpowder age was not used (though I don't see why anyone would want it).
What's the EoFM?
If you don't want to have an era included, you just don't download it. This is one of the mainreasons I suggest this era.
shadowmaster wrote:The engine also assumes that add-ons consist on single-dir or single-file packages (add-on-name/ or add-on-name.cfg). Multiple top-level directories would not be handled gracefully, so factions/ would be considered a pbl-less (not publishable) add-on named "factions".
Even if I have some idea how to go arround, I do know too less to. Are there any good descriptions on that? Also, some UMC campaigns are able to(e.g.: Kromire, "{~add-ons/Era_of_Myths/_main.cfg}", _main.cfg), so did I missunderstood what you say?
Velensk wrote:Out of vague curiosity, in cases where there are multiple versions of an era which would you use?
The new one will overwrite the old one.

Velensk
Multiplayer Contributor
Posts: 3991
Joined: January 24th, 2007, 12:56 am

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Velensk »

You misunderstand me: I am saying that I do not think the gunpowder age should be an option in your 'all eras' faction.

EoFM: Era of Four Moons.
"There are two kinds of old men in the world. The kind who didn't go to war and who say that they should have lived fast died young and left a handsome corpse and the old men who did go to war and who say that there is no such thing as a handsome corpse."

fog_of_gold
Posts: 637
Joined: December 20th, 2009, 5:59 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by fog_of_gold »

Velensk wrote:You misunderstand me: I am saying that I do not think the gunpowder age should be an option in your 'all eras' faction.
Then it won't be included. What's your problem now about this?

Velensk
Multiplayer Contributor
Posts: 3991
Joined: January 24th, 2007, 12:56 am

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Velensk »

As near as I can tell none. What makes you think I'd have a problem about it not being included when that was what I asked for?
"There are two kinds of old men in the world. The kind who didn't go to war and who say that they should have lived fast died young and left a handsome corpse and the old men who did go to war and who say that there is no such thing as a handsome corpse."

Qazerowl
Posts: 61
Joined: July 12th, 2009, 3:37 pm

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Qazerowl »

I can't help but think how stupid this argument is! If someone sets up an unbalanced era combination, then that's too bad! Be the overpowered fraction!
Gambit's Era Idea:
That is by far the best way to do this.

User avatar
Captain_Wrathbow
Posts: 1664
Joined: June 30th, 2009, 2:03 pm
Location: Guardia

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Captain_Wrathbow »

Qazerowl wrote:I can't help but think how stupid this argument is! If someone sets up an unbalanced era combination, then that's too bad! Be the overpowered fraction!
Gambit's Era Idea:
That is by far the best way to do this.
Although I imagine it could potentially cause difficulty with some WML-heavy special eras. (like Modern Combat, or GEB)

But that's a really cool idea, and if there's a way to get it to work, that would be awesome. 8)

User avatar
Iris
Site Administrator
Posts: 6617
Joined: November 14th, 2006, 5:54 pm
Location: Chile
Contact:

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Iris »

fog_of_gold wrote:Even if I have some idea how to go arround, I do know too less to. Are there any good descriptions on that? Also, some UMC campaigns are able to(e.g.: Kromire, "{~add-ons/Era_of_Myths/_main.cfg}", _main.cfg), so did I missunderstood what you say?
Yes, you did. ;)

I was talking about what Wesnoth considers an "add-on" for uploading and downloading. Naturally, the add-ons' actual WML can reference other add-ons' (or core) WML via preprocessor constructs like that, or import their images, sound files, etc.
Author of the unofficial UtBS sequels Invasion from the Unknown and After the Storm.

User avatar
Gambit
Loose Screw
Posts: 3266
Joined: August 13th, 2008, 3:00 pm
Location: Dynamica
Contact:

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Gambit »

fog_of_gold wrote: These eras mustn't be included since they contain new features. Exactly this is the reason I don't like the idea of your suggestion. Also, your suggestion would allow to have a hero+default era.
And this is a technical problem in what way? If the host chooses to host a Heroes+Default match then he/she is okay with some people picking default factions and some people picking heroes factions.

And as far as "new features", I don't know of any popular pure-faction-eras that do not use WML event abilities.

Also Wrathbow, as events do not have ID's there is no problem with WML heavy eras either. The issues would be customly named events that the add-ons trigger with [fire_event], macros, and variables. In that case the authors would have to rename their events, macros, and variables to be unique for their add-on. Good authors already do this with units because of possible conflicts, so I see no reason why they wouldn't adapt for that as well.

fog_of_gold
Posts: 637
Joined: December 20th, 2009, 5:59 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by fog_of_gold »

Qazerowl wrote:I can't help but think how stupid this argument is! If someone sets up an unbalanced era combination, then that's too bad! Be the overpowered fraction! [...]
You didn't understand my arguments, did you? There are eras are pretty balanced, but their factions are stronger or weaker than the mainline ones. Some of the eras are even meant to be stronger/weaker than others.
Gambit wrote:[...]And as far as "new features", I don't know of any popular pure-faction-eras that do not use WML event abilities.[...]
I was talking about features, and not about events. A unit having included an ability with events, would be able to be included with my idea. Eras like the "Era of High Sorcery" includes new features of the game. You wouldn't be able to mix this era with any other eras.
shadowmaster wrote:[...]I was talking about what Wesnoth considers an "add-on" for uploading and downloading. Naturally, the add-ons' actual WML can reference other add-ons' (or core) WML via preprocessor constructs like that, or import their images, sound files, etc.
OK, I think I understood you now. I'll think of something.

User avatar
Captain_Wrathbow
Posts: 1664
Joined: June 30th, 2009, 2:03 pm
Location: Guardia

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Captain_Wrathbow »

Gambit wrote:Also Wrathbow, as events do not have ID's there is no problem with WML heavy eras either. The issues would be customly named events that the add-ons trigger with [fire_event], macros, and variables. In that case the authors would have to rename their events, macros, and variables to be unique for their add-on. Good authors already do this with units because of possible conflicts, so I see no reason why they wouldn't adapt for that as well.
Huh... I see. :)
Now I really like the era-checkboxes idea.

User avatar
Gambit
Loose Screw
Posts: 3266
Joined: August 13th, 2008, 3:00 pm
Location: Dynamica
Contact:

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Gambit »

fog_of_gold wrote: I was talking about features, and not about events. A unit having included an ability with events, would be able to be included with my idea. Eras like the "Era of High Sorcery" includes new features of the game. You wouldn't be able to mix this era with any other eras.
And just why can't I?

fog_of_gold
Posts: 637
Joined: December 20th, 2009, 5:59 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by fog_of_gold »

My suggested era, aren't able to recruit if they do not level up. But indeed, it wasn't a very good example. Let me choose another one: Galactic Empires. This era is really including new features.

User avatar
Gambit
Loose Screw
Posts: 3266
Joined: August 13th, 2008, 3:00 pm
Location: Dynamica
Contact:

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by Gambit »

Again. Just why can I not play that with say... Era of Magic?

Of course there will be combinations that don't play well together. Players just won't use those then. It in no way invalidates the idea to allow for combinations.

fog_of_gold
Posts: 637
Joined: December 20th, 2009, 5:59 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [UMC]all-factions-era

Post by fog_of_gold »

You can't play the era of magic without castles if you aren't a summoner. I can't remember at the moment, if the ships are changing, but if, the EOMa factions would even be not able to capture new planets.

Locked