Support for multiple leaders?

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irrevenant
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Support for multiple leaders?

Post by irrevenant »

There a number of potential Single Player scenarios where it would be useful to have multiple leaders (ie. multiple units capable of recruiting).

I'm not suggesting a change in standard gameplay but it would be useful to have this functionality available for campaign-designers.

P.S. I searched to see if this topic had already been raised and didn't find anything quite like it (though there were a couple of similar ideas such as recruitable subcommanders).
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Post by some guy I know »

You can accomplish something very similar by having more than one side controlled by the player.
(For example, in Northern Rebirth, the player controls as many as three sides.)
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Post by Vendanna »

Well, it would be funny if the units with leadership were able to recruit troops in castles as your normal unit to follow them on their ranks like in a chain of command.

Tought, you must remember that by allowing more than one leader the assault opponent castle if it has more than two towers and build units from there is a serious balance issue, especially if you are taking the charge by playing as first player.

Anyhow I'm usually playing on random maps (the generated ones) and I have never found a way to generate additional castles for castle hopping.
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Re: Support for multiple leaders?

Post by appleide »

irrevenant wrote:There a number of potential Single Player scenarios where it would be useful to have multiple leaders (ie. multiple units capable of recruiting).

I'm not suggesting a change in standard gameplay but it would be useful to have this functionality available for campaign-designers.

P.S. I searched to see if this topic had already been raised and didn't find anything quite like it (though there were a couple of similar ideas such as recruitable subcommanders).
Apparently, the developers welcome this, but only if you implement it yourself. It is said to take several hundred lines of code that interacts with several hundred thousand other lines. (eg, replays, saves, etc)... Unfortunately I don't know C++ nor is Wesnoth written in Java, so I couldn't do it.
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Post by Edward V Riley »

That would be great for larger type scenarios.

If ever a huge, major battle would be used in any era or scenario, this would have to be the way it's done. Closest thing to that is the last scenario in Northern Rebirth where you have 3 commanders you control, plus an allied one. Sure the battle lasts a long time, but sometimes I crave that type.

If ever large scale battles are depicted in Wesnoth, it'll have to be numerous commanders or subcommanders in order to produce the necessary units.
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Post by Noyga »

IMHO giving multiple sides to a player does a great job here.
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irrevenant
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Post by irrevenant »

Noyga wrote:IMHO giving multiple sides to a player does a great job here.
Would you be able to pool income and gold between the two sides? If not, it's not really the same thing.

Even if you can, it's still not ideal because it means you have to keep track of two different colours of units and you have to move (eg.) all the red ones then all the blue ones, which isn't very flexible.

P.S. I assume it's not possible to change which unit is the leader mid-turn? That would enable a workaround (change who's the leader whenever one of the potential leader units is selected).
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Post by zookeeper »

irrevenant wrote:P.S. I assume it's not possible to change which unit is the leader mid-turn?
It's possible.
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Post by Noyga »

irrevenant wrote:
Noyga wrote:IMHO giving multiple sides to a player does a great job here.
Would you be able to pool income and gold between the two sides? If not, it's not really the same thing.
Yes it is possible.
IIRC Elf wars did this.
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Post by YbeRn00b »

Vendanna wrote:Well, it would be funny if the units with leadership were able to recruit troops in castles as your normal unit to follow them on their ranks like in a chain of command.
Units with leadership being able to recruit any troops of lower level sounds like a good idea to me. That could even be included mainline.
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Post by BuBu »

I like this ideia. It seems like "sub-leaders" that you can lose it without lose the game. Could it has restrict number of "sub-leaders" like 2 or 5?

One question: If the leader get dead what will happen with the game? The "sub-leader" will take the control?
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Post by Velensk »

YbeRn00b wrote:
Vendanna wrote:Well, it would be funny if the units with leadership were able to recruit troops in castles as your normal unit to follow them on their ranks like in a chain of command.
Units with leadership being able to recruit any troops of lower level sounds like a good idea to me. That could even be included mainline.
I don't think so for a few diffrent reasons.
The first is that the olny two races I can think of quickly that get lvl 2 leadership are rebles and drakes. In a maps like say castle hopping isle. If either player gets a lvl 2 unit with leadership he will suddenly have all the mobile recruiting ability of his leader without having to risk his leader. For specialised senarios the ability to have multiple leaders or to switch leaders would be usefull. However for mainline multiplayer granting control of a side works fine.
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Post by waw »

What I thought would be neat is in a campaign have your regular hero, say an elf. He becomes friends with an orc and with a loyalist. Follow?

Well the Orc can recruit his orc buddies, the elf only elves and the human can recruit humans or what not.

But you would lose if any of them died. Now true, you could create a campaign and control seperate sides that are allied, but having them pull supplies together to try and do it would be a very nice challenge.


I don't have the knowledge to do this sadly, but in the campaign I am working on multiple sides worked well enough I guess.


And for my idea, of the elves recruiting elves and such, you can always set it up in coding that if your elf dies, you can't recruit any elves. Same with Mer folk and orcs. That could accomplish that end easy enough.
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Post by Infinisearch »

As long as you can give castles/keeps a side or neutral and a racial attribute/filter. So that some keeps can only be used by side one, another can be used any side but can only recruit loyalists. Side by side with waws idea of filtering the recuit list per leader or subleader it would allow for some interesting possibilities. Limiting the amount of subleaders might also need to be addressed and how to limit. (upperbound and/or extra upkeep) How finances are addressed would also be addressed so that you COULD have scenario's where one leader is the strategic leader, and one is the financial leader. Strategic leader decides how to divide up the recall list (pos both in MP and SP) and potencially other per Campaign special features. While the financial leader doles out starting funds (again pos both in MP and SP) and to divide up income. An abstract leader type set, with associated responsibilities would be nice.
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Post by waw »

Sounds extremely complicated but I like it. It would be neat to have on a 'hard' style gameplay for those that are advanced. Give them a new challenge.
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