Era names

Post by **turin** » June 11th, 2006, 2:18 pm

BTW, I'm not a huge fan of the name suggestions I posted, they were just for brainstorming.

I disagree that "Default" has gameplay value. Apparently some people find it confusing, and I fail to see how it is any better than "Great Continent (default)" or somesuch.

Garion · Post by **Garion** » June 12th, 2006, 6:47 pm

It took me two weeks to realize that "Default" was an era in its own right.

I thought it was akin to Starcraft's "use map settings" option- eg, that the map designer specified a default era in each multiplayer map and that failing to select an era to play in (or selecting "default") would result in you playing an era specified by the map's scenario code.

That didn't sound very interesting to me, so I never chose it, with the result that my early experience of the game left me vaguely dissatisfied with the multiplayer era options. Great War left me with too little detail about the various races- and only two sides!-, Age of Heroes was overwhelming for a newbie, Classic (I started playing at 1.0.2) was obscenely imbalanced.

The ideal era that I should have started in was the one that I totally overlooked, because of its name.

That's what the bug report is complaining of. It's scarcely a critical issue, and I post here only because of the posts like JW's that inquire about whether there's an issue at all.

JW · Post by JW » June 12th, 2006, 7:22 pm

That thought process(in the bug report) just seems odd to me. Now, if you change the name you'll have the problem of people possibly not knowing which era is the main era, and if you add "(default)" to the end of the name you might have the same problem as in this report.

It really seems like a lose/lose if you change the name, and the problem has only occured once (apparently) in Wesnoth history, so why would you change the name for a person who has already figured the situation out?

If changing anything, add a Tome of Wesnoth entry and something in the ReadMe that says "The 'Default' era is the main era of BfW that conatins these 6 factions...." so that it won't happen again in the future. Changing the name adds more, and bigger, problems than it fixes.

scott · Post by **scott** » June 12th, 2006, 7:59 pm

turin wrote:"Great Continent (default)" or somesuch.

Now hold on here.
"Great Continent (default)" is much different than "Great Continent" (and probably better than "default" by itself)

Garion · Post by **Garion** » June 12th, 2006, 8:22 pm

I agree with Scott. Besides, JW, I didn't write the bug report, but whoever did had exactly the same problem I did.

Which means it's happened at least twice. A problem that can be independantly replicated deserves attention and discussion, at least. I think the fix to the Tome would work just as well as the change of name, but I lean toward the name change for simple flavor reasons. Great Continent (default) isn't terribly much longer than, say, All Factions Era, and it clearly conveys the information that default is an age unto itself.

Post by **irrevenant** » June 12th, 2006, 10:15 pm

"Great Continent" is a place, not an era. Something like "Throne War" would probably be a better name.

Post by **turin** » June 12th, 2006, 11:00 pm

Except that if it is called "Throne War", what place do the Drakes and the Saracens (assuming the Saracens are added) have in the era?

Default is not tied to HttT, and it shouldn't be named as if it is.

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » June 12th, 2006, 11:10 pm

turin wrote:Default is not tied to HttT, and it shouldn't be named as if it is.

indeed.

Post by **irrevenant** » June 13th, 2006, 10:07 am

turin wrote:Except that if it is called "Throne War", what place do the Drakes and the Saracens (assuming the Saracens are added) have in the era?
Default is not tied to HttT, and it shouldn't be named as if it is.

Fair enough. But "The Great Continent" is still a place, not an era.

Arguably, "Throne War" speaks of a time period as well as an event. eg. Ecuadorians lived in "The WWII era" even though (AFAIK) they weren't involved in the war itself. But I'm totally open to alternate suggestions.

Historically, age names have tended to be thematic:
Mediaeval ("The Middle Age")
"The Dark Ages"
"The Renaissance" ("Rebirth")

Perhaps something like that would be appropriate?

Ranger M · Post by **Ranger M** » June 13th, 2006, 12:05 pm

The Golden age (default)

A part when all of the factions would be correct in wesnoth's history is even called this, in Turin's version.

appleide · Post by **appleide** » June 13th, 2006, 12:26 pm

JW wrote:That thought process(in the bug report) just seems odd to me. Now, if you change the name you'll have the problem of people possibly not knowing which era is the main era, and if you add "(default)" to the end of the name you might have the same problem as in this report.

scott wrote:
turin wrote:"Great Continent (default)" or somesuch.
Now hold on here.
"Great Continent (default)" is much different than "Great Continent" (and probably better than "default" by itself)

I like "Golden Age (default)". "Throne War" reminds me of the bathroom, for some reason.

Na'enthos · Post by **Na'enthos** » June 13th, 2006, 12:38 pm

Related to the subject at hand: is there any clarification as to what 'Era' actually are and as to what each era is (it's theme or something, I don't know a lot about era myself)?

I don't play multiplayer a lot, but I'd say that if there isn't, this information may be useful to put in a read me or available in the game itself.

(To the resp. moderator: I don't mind if you make this a separate topic if you think it necessary..)

Post by **turin** » June 13th, 2006, 1:23 pm

"Era" does seem to be a strange name, since most new eras actually deal with different places, not different times in Wesnoth's history.

Post by **Noyga** » June 13th, 2006, 1:51 pm

Actually AFAIK "most new eras" = The Imperial era, while a lot more new eras (Snow dwarves, Marsh, Extended, Peasant,...) don't even do an assumption of the place nor the time.

Post by **turin** » June 13th, 2006, 1:59 pm

Noyga wrote:Actually most new eras (Snow Dwarves, Marsh, Sauron's less luck, Peasant, Extended,...) don't make any assumption on the time & place, AFAIK the only one is the Imperial Era (only the place).

The Marsh Era takes place in the marshes between Wesnoth and the Aethenwood, IIRC, and it specifies no time. And the Era of Myths, the only other era with mostly original factions, (other than the Imperial Era) does specify a place - southeast of Wesnoth - , but (again) not a time.

The rest of the eras I don't consider "eras", per se, but rather abominations.

Specifically, the Snow Dwarves era just adds a new faction to the default era, which is always a bad idea (although many "eras" do this - most eras are just proposals of new factions that can't think of a better way to publish them); Sauron's less luck is not an era so much as a mod of the game; the Peasant era is just stupid because it mixes willy-nilly factions from the Old Continent, factions from the Great Continent, and factions that as yet have no place; and the same goes for the Extended Era.

So, basically, from now on when I refer to "new eras", I mean the Imperial Era dn the Era of Myths. Because those are the only two I consider worth talking about.